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Financial costs of the American Revolutionary War

Discussion in 'Library and Editorials' started by BarnacleBob, Dec 1, 2013.



  1. BarnacleBob

    BarnacleBob GIM Founding Member & Mod. Founding Member Site Mgr Site Supporter

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    I believe that to be correct... Revolutions & rebellions are not created or supported by the commoners, why would they risk life & limb only to return to their same old mundane existence? Revolutions & Political Evolutions are almost always the result of the wealthy classes in dispute.... war is a rich mans game fought by poor people as the saying goes....

    Their called commoners for a reason, not leaders! And this stands to reason, as the most aggressive, smartest and greatest educated will usually rise to the top. Wealth is benefit and is the distinguishing factor in a neo cosmopolitan society....

    Why would this class revolt today? The Fed and the political machinery are literally missing this classes asses to prevent such events from transpiring....

    There is almost no risk in making poor people poorer.... but there is great risk in making the rich to wealthy classes FEEL poorer... thats the beauty of the hidden laws of inflation, the net wealth continues to increase NUMERICALLY, creating the "wealth effect" while the purchasing power of that accumulated wealth dimishes....

    Its the driver for the bubble economy.... keep the rich & wealthy happy even at the expense of the middle & poor classes.... for it is always the rich & wealthy whom overthrow the status quo, not the I.Q. 100's....however it is the I.Q. 100's who will fight & die at the hands of the propaghanda by both sides = cannon fodder = collateral damage!
     
  2. Argent Dragon

    Argent Dragon Site Support Site Mgr Site Supporter

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    So as HT would have put it - the 'Top' feeds off the 'Bottom' and so forth. However, what about 'peak wealth' when numerically it's no longer able to support itself and the bubble of all bubbles bursts (i.e. the currency) ?!? :afraid:

    OR does the game just continue on and on and on until the elites wish (by their own desire for power & profit) to change the game via warfare ?
     
  3. BarnacleBob

    BarnacleBob GIM Founding Member & Mod. Founding Member Site Mgr Site Supporter

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    Wish I could answer your question... history is cyclical only because time may change, but most people do not.... Peak Wealth? Someone needs to prove it, not merely state it!

    From a historical standpoint, whenever technology & innovation moves forward, it causes great calamity within the entrenched status quo.... consider how when the English discovered how to use time to discover the geographic location of the vessel relative to the terminus port they were seeking.... the entire world was changed and altered.... imperialism & merchantilism were blended created a great competition between TPTB of the period....

    The ENTIRE known world was reorganized by that single discovery! The world is constantly reorganizing itself, however this reorganization is usually recognized and/or attributed by specific events.... the events leading to the specific events are generally overlooked....

    Seems to me that we as hu-mans are on the cusp of another reorganization, we wont know until we come out of the other side.... but make no doubt, BIG changes along with reorganization is coming! When? Its happening right now! Always has been!

    JMO
     
  4. Argent Dragon

    Argent Dragon Site Support Site Mgr Site Supporter

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    The U.S. Continental Congress endorsed Thomas Jefferson’s Declaration of Independence on July 4, 1776, and, with it, the conflict with Britain became a full-fledged War of Independence.

    Unable to defeat the strong British military on their own, the American colonists required foreign assistance. John Adams approached the French with the “Model Treaty” that protected neutral trade and shipping rights in the event of a war. The French decision to sign this commercial treaty with the American colonists made them an ally in the war against Britain.


    In 1778, the French formally established their position as an ally with a treaty of alliance that committed the French to the war on the condition that the Americans did not seek a separate peace with Britain. Following the British surrender at the Battle of Yorktown, however, the Americans negotiated independently despite their agreement with France. Ultimately, the French reacted mildly out of concern for their own position with regard to Britain and Spain. The final treaty granted full independence and recognized the borders of the new United States of America.

    Source : http://history.state.gov/milestones/1776-1783
     
  5. Scorpio

    Scorpio Скорпион Founding Member Board Elder Site Mgr Site Supporter ++

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    excerpt from here provided by user 789,

    http://name789.wordpress.com/resident-evil/

    under the resident evil section
     
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  6. BarnacleBob

    BarnacleBob GIM Founding Member & Mod. Founding Member Site Mgr Site Supporter

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    All sounds good until you realize this:

    American Revolutionary War - April 19, 1775 – September 3, 1783 (8 years, 4 months, 2 weeks and 1 day)
     
  7. Hystckndle

    Hystckndle Daguerreotype Fanatic Site Mgr Site Supporter ++

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  8. noctis lucis caelum

    noctis lucis caelum Silver Member Silver Miner

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    Im really enjoying this thread more interesting things i did not get taught in school.
     
  9. BarnacleBob

    BarnacleBob GIM Founding Member & Mod. Founding Member Site Mgr Site Supporter

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    The facts dont equate with the "off-i-shul" fairy tales! Gee, surprise. Public Schools are not designed to educate, they are created to indoctrinate by compulsion....

    Once the "chill-rens" have learned the basics around 5th - 6th grade in public schools, the political & social indoctrination begins... tests are given to insure the targets are receiving the political programing scripts.... ever wonder why these institutions dont teach balancing checkbooks, managing credit, political science or even vocational training? Its programing, that why American aptitude tests fall off a cliff after 6th grade compared to rest of modern world... thats what we pay for & get for "the children!" Of course, who could deny the "children" for they are our future.... BARF!
     
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  10. Argent Dragon

    Argent Dragon Site Support Site Mgr Site Supporter

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    When the public school system was first created with the funds of Vanderbilt, Rockefeller, etc. the primary goal was to produce intelligent workers for companies for industrialized America.

    Later, after the system had already been in place for decades, the next generation of leaders started permeating the system via textbooks with the indoctrination part on politics and social engineering. With each passing decade and each generation it seems to get worse not better. Once a system is in place, even if the current generation has good intentions, the following generation of power will make adjustments to that system in order to churn out their desired results. It's not about the individual, it's more about training the masses with a feel safe within the herd mentality. It makes it a lot easier (and peaceful) for the TPTB to remain TPTB without any upset of a power struggle. Although unpopular, it's akin to people farming.
     
  11. Argent Dragon

    Argent Dragon Site Support Site Mgr Site Supporter

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    ....did a search on 'yamaguchy incorporated' and found this site as well:

    http://www.yamaguchy.com/

    [TABLE="width: 100%, align: center"]
    Silver coins, Treasury notes, Money power [TR]
    [TD="width: 50%, align: right"][​IMG] Letters of Thomas Jefferson
    The Anti-Bank Democrat
    The Slave Trade, Henry Carey
    A New Monetary System, Edward Kellogg
    Financial Catechism, S.M. Brice
    Ideas for Good Government, Peter Cooper
    The Great Red Dragon, L.B. Woolfolk
    A Call to Action, James Weaver
    Shylock: as Banker, Gordon Clark
    The Money Problem, Arthur Kitson
    The Coming of American Fascism, Lawrence Dennis
    [/TD]
    [TD="width: 50%, align: left"] William Gouge, Paper Money and Banking
    Elbridge Spaulding, History of the Legal Tender Paper Money
    [​IMG]The Story and Debates of Central Banking
    —in Congress, from 1811 to 1869
    William Berkey, The Money Question
    Henry Loucks,
    The Great Conspiracy of the House of Morgan
    Christopher Hollis, The Two Nations
    Gustavus Myers, History of the Supreme Court
    David Astle, The Babylonian Woe
    Funck-Brentano, Philip the Fair
    [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [/TABLE]
     
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  12. Argent Dragon

    Argent Dragon Site Support Site Mgr Site Supporter

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    Similar to Continental Dollars, here's the real father of those famous "Greenbacks" issued during the American Civil War:

    From Name789's site >> On December 30, 1861, Mr. Spaulding introduced in the House a bill to authorize the issue of legal-tender Treasury notes (House Bill, No. 182)
    On December 31, 1861, Mr. Spaulding published in the New York Tribune his concept of issuing legal tender Treasury notes —but we can’t expect fabricators to be familiar with newspapers;

    Elbridge Gerry Spaulding (February 24, 1809 – May 5, 1897 was an American lawyer, banker, and politician.[SUP][2][/SUP][SUP][3][/SUP] He supported the idea for the first U.S. currency not backed by gold or silver, thus helping to keep the Union economy afloat during the Civil War.

    He was New York State Treasurer from 1854 to 1855, and was elected again to the U.S. House of Representatives as a Republican, serving in the 36th and 37th United States Congresses from 1859 to 1863. Spaulding was a congressman who saw a problem coming and had a solution ready. It was he who figured out that the American government needed to print money to pay for the Civil War. It was regarded as economic heresy then, but without it the country might not have survived. Such an idea was then dismissed by some as “fiat money,” money that is money not because it is backed by gold or silver, but because some government says it is money. He was chairman of a House Ways and Means subcommittee when the government was in danger of running out of money to pay for the war. He wrote a law that allowed the government to print money and declare it had to be accepted as legal tender.

    In 1862, he drafted the Legal Tender Act, and the National Currency Bank Bill. At the time, the only circulating paper money was notes issued by banks. Those notes were supposed to be convertible into gold, although the banks had been forced to suspend such conversions at the end of 1861. There was no central bank. The bill passed Congress not because it was thought to be good policy absent a crisis, but because it was necessary. “It was at once a loan to the government without interest and a national currency, which was so much needed for disbursement in small sums during the pressing exigencies of the war,” Spaulding wrote years later in his book, “History of the Legal Tender Paper Money.”

    In 1869, he published History of the Legal Tender Paper Money Issued During the Great Rebellion.

    Source : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elbridge_G._Spaulding


     
  13. 789

    789 New Member

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    Thank ye for your interest in my sites

    www.yamaguchy.com
    http://name789.wordpress.com

    an old thread on this forum, regarding my work---
    http://www.goldismoney2.com/showthread.php?890-A-place-to-start-learning&p=3467&viewfull=1#post3467
    ========================

    The real cost of the Revolutionary War (including interest)
    Legislative history of greenbacks---
    http://www.yamaguchy.com/library/spaulding/green_index.html
    150 years later, it awaited me to compile it --as I say in my article: the Record is a cruel thing, it ruins the best illusions; in this case the Record shows the exact opposite of what was sold to us by book-peddlers, and even school-books

    the story of central banking in the United States, from 1869 to 1811---
    http://www.yamaguchy.com/library/uregina/speeches.html


    ============
    less than 3 weeks from now, the 100th anniversary of Fed Res is here; to this day, not one person had the courage to read the (his)story of the federal reserve act !!!

    Should someone be brave enough to read the Record, it would be an entertaining (and educational, and illusion ruining) experience.
     
    Last edited: Dec 5, 2013
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  14. BarnacleBob

    BarnacleBob GIM Founding Member & Mod. Founding Member Site Mgr Site Supporter

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    Elbridge Gerry Spaulding (February 24, 1809 – May 5, 1897 was an American lawyer, banker, and politician. [2][3] He supported the idea for the first U.S. currency not backed by gold or silver, thus helping to keep the Union economy afloat during the Civil War.

    The Trifecta..... whats wrong with this picture? "ALL enemies, both foreign & domestic"

    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murderer is less to fear." -- Cicero
     
  15. 789

    789 New Member

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    "And I sincerely believe, with you, that banking establishments are more dangerous than standing armies; and that the principle of spending money to be paid by posterity, under the name of funding, is but swindling futurity on a large scale."
    http://www.yamaguchy.com/library/jefferson/jefftaylor.html
     
  16. 789

    789 New Member

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    Not true: the United States notes promised to pay, and eventually did pay gold.
     
  17. noctis lucis caelum

    noctis lucis caelum Silver Member Silver Miner

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    http://www.dailypaul.com/80247/can-we-please-stop-propagating-the-fake-jefferson-quote-about-private-banks
    "I believe that banking institutions are more dangerous to our liberties than standing armies. If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their currency, first by inflation, then by deflation, the banks and corporations that will grow up around [the banks] will deprive the people of all property until their children wake-up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered. The issuing power should be taken from the banks and restored to the people, to whom it properly belongs."

    This is a fake. No one has been able to say where Jefferson wrote this. It's been spreading around the internet and has even made it in a few books (unsourced). This book points out that the quote is "spurious:" (The term "deflation" cannot even be traced back further than 1920, and the term "inflation" 1864 - long after Jefferson died).

    Also, this quote disagrees with Ron Paul who says that the best thing would be to allow the private market to create money (which is the standard position among Austrian economists). Dr. Paul would not be opposed to private banks creating money. He is for privately produced money rather than government money (http://www.ronpaullibrary.org/document.php?id=914) What he is opposed to is a single bank (the Fed) being granted a monopoly by the government to print legal tender, and the legal tender law which enforces the use of that money. Private banks, with no government granted monopoly, printing money, including commodity-backed money, is not a problem. That's what a free market in money would be. So not only the quote fraudulent but it doesn't align with the free market philosophy. It's more like something a socialist would say to justify nationalization (in fact I've seen that advocated here, and using this bogus quote to back it up http://www.dailypaul.com/node/80103). Jefferson was not a socialist.

    Finally, note that though the Constitution allows the government to coin money, it doesn't forbid the people AND THE BANKS THEY OWN from coining and printing money. The Constitution restricts the government, not the people and their private businesses.
     
  18. 789

    789 New Member

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    So, why are you talking to me ? (your reading and comprehension seems to be at the level of a groupie)

    Have you ever read any of Thomas Jefferson's letters ?
     
  19. noctis lucis caelum

    noctis lucis caelum Silver Member Silver Miner

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    I do research before i believe things are true or not.
     
  20. Scorpio

    Scorpio Скорпион Founding Member Board Elder Site Mgr Site Supporter ++

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    and RP being the brain surgeon, doesn't take it to its logical conclusion either,

    for instance if private banks can create money and extend credit then too can corporations or companies.

    does the 'shopping at the company store' using company script as money ring a bell?

    or maybe indentured servitude????

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indentured_servant

    Awww Scorp, that isn't what he meant.........

    to be a true Austrian, or even a true Libertarian, that is exactly what it means
     
  21. BarnacleBob

    BarnacleBob GIM Founding Member & Mod. Founding Member Site Mgr Site Supporter

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    Not to get off track, but there is much numerology & gematria around us, including the formation of America & its U.S. .gov! This is exploring the realm of the meta-physical.

    We begin with 13 colonies....

    What is the biblical meaning of the number 13?

    http://www.biblestudy.org/bibleref/meaning-of-numbers-in-bible/13.html

    Biblically, there were 12 Apostles and one Christ = 13

    The Federal Reserve System is constructed with 12 district banks and the Federal Reserve Board = 13

    The Meaning of Numbers: The Number 12

    http://www.biblestudy.org/bibleref/meaning-of-numbers-in-bible/12.html

    NOTE the language @ Signers U.S. Const. 1787

    " Done in convention by the unanimous consent of the states present the seventeenth day of September in the year of our Lord one thousand seven hundred and eighty seven and of the independence of the United States of America the twelfth."

    http://www.law.cornell.edu/constitution/signers

    QUESTION: Just EXACTLY who are they DECLARING independence from by signing this Constitution??? Themselves or someone/something else. We are taught/told that independence was achieved by & thru the Declaration & Revolutionary War, further consumated by the Articles of Confederation and Perpetual Union. Yet in 1787 they openly declare independence for the United States of America the 12th.... were there 11 other United States? Just exactly what does this statement "the twelfth" mean???

    Next the Constitution creates the political TRINITY of powers doctrine, an Executive, a Legislative and Judicial branches are created.... additionally the judiciary is granted three jurisdictions, Admiralty, Equity & (Common) Law.

    The meaning of the number three:

    http://www.biblestudy.org/bibleref/meaning-of-numbers-in-bible/3.html

    There are 50 states, why only 50, not 49 or 51???

    NUMBER 50

    The purpose of the number 50 is to promote fusion between body and soul, mind and spirit. Life is a continuing education for the number 50, as this energy seeks to learn their real values relating to their ultimate goals and aspirations, and learning to obey their inner feelings to ‘know thyself’. The happy disposition of the 50 Destiny number attracts friends and good fortune and they know how to take advantage of all the blessings -- Mentally, Physically and Spiritually.

    The focus of 50 is to attain greater stability. The law of 5 is 'freedom in action', and when coupled with the vibration of the number 0, this energy is amplified.

    http://numerology-thenumbersandtheirmeanings.blogspot.com/2011/06/number-50.html?m=1

    Number 39:

    Notice that the Bilderberg Group has core of 39 members who are broken into 3 groups of 13 members in each group. Notice that the core of 39 answers to the 13 who make up the Policy Committee. Take special notice that the 13 members of the Policy Committee answer to the Round Table of Nine. You know that the original number of states in the United States of America was 13. The Constitution has 7 articles and was signed by 39 members of the Constitutional Convention. More research is to be done on this number.

    Who were our fathers that framed the Constitution? I suppose the "thirty-nine" who signed the original instrument may be fairly called our fathers who framed that part of the present government. It is almost exactly true to say they framed it, and it is altogether true to say they fairly represented the opinion and sentiment of the whole nation at that time. Their names, being familiar to nearly all, and accessible to quite all, need not now be repeated. I take these "thirty-nine," for the present, as being "our fathers who framed the government under which we live." What is the question which, according to the text, those fathers understood "just as well, and even better, than we do now"? (Abraham Lincoln, "Cooper Institute Address," 27 February 1860) Cooper Institute Address

    This should be enuff to twist your head for a little while... needless to state, theres much more to be analyized....
     
  22. BarnacleBob

    BarnacleBob GIM Founding Member & Mod. Founding Member Site Mgr Site Supporter

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    "The nited tates (us) of America the twelfth"

    The Meaning of Numbers: The Number 12

    Twelve is a perfect number, signifying perfection of government, or of governmental perfection. It is found as a multiple in all that has to do with rule. The sun which "rules" the day, and the moon and stars which "govern" the night, do so by their passage through the twelve signs of the Zodiac which completes the great circle of the heavens of 360 (12 x 30) degrees or divisions, and thus govern the year.

    Twelve is the product of 3 (the perfectly Divine and heavenly number) and 4 (the earthly of what is material and organic). While seven is composed of 3 added to 4, twelve is 3 multiplied by 4, and hence denotes that which can scarcely be explained in words, but which the spiritual perception can at once appreciate, viz., organization, the products denoting production and multiplication and increase of all that is contained in the two numbers separately. The 4 is generally prominently seen in the twelve.*****

    NUMEROLOGY: Attributes of NUMBERS 0 to 10

    http://numerology-thenumbersandtheirmeanings.blogspot.com/p/attributes-of-numbers-0-to-10.html?m=1

    Hebrew Gematria
    Finding numerical relationships in the Texts


    http://www.hebrew4christians.com/Grammar/Unit_Eight/Hebrew_Gematria/hebrew_gematria.html
     
  23. Argent Dragon

    Argent Dragon Site Support Site Mgr Site Supporter

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    And for the CONFEDERACY:

    13 stars on the battle flag (southern cross).........stands for 11 states + kentucky & missouri (split states w/militias fighting on both sides)

    7th-miss_0.jpg
     
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  24. BarnacleBob

    BarnacleBob GIM Founding Member & Mod. Founding Member Site Mgr Site Supporter

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    FOOTPRINTS...... FOOTPRINTS & MORE FOOTPRINTS! Follow the path of footprints!
     
  25. Argent Dragon

    Argent Dragon Site Support Site Mgr Site Supporter

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    NOTE : We currently have NINE justices that comprise the Supreme Court.

    Originally we had 6 in 13 districts (there's that number again).

    Congress organized the Court that year with the passage of the Judiciary Act of 1789. It specified the Court's original and appellate jurisdiction, created thirteen judicial districts, and fixed the number of justices at six (one chief justice and five associate justices).
     
  26. 789

    789 New Member

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    Really ?!!

    If bother to look at the link you give on the dailypaul forum, you will notice me as one who explained how that "quote" was fabricated
    You did not do anything; you simply present what you acquired from people like me; you yourself never took the time to familiarize yourself with Jefferson's views

    2) my reply was clearly addressed to "Argent Dragon" pointing out that his signature is slightly in-accurate; that he have not read Jefferson's letter(s); that he is just rtying to impress the ignorant

    3) you have been here on this forum how many years? and did not say anything to him

    4) This is the correct quote:-- "And I sincerely believe, with you, that banking establishments are more dangerous than standing armies; and that the principle of spending money to be paid by posterity, under the name of funding, is but swindling futurity on a large scale."
    http://www.yamaguchy.com/library/jefferson/jefftaylor.html
    If you had had the courage to click on the link, you could have read the full text of the letter

    5) you should keep quite while grownups are talking

    6) be brave, and read what Jefferson had to say on money, banking---
    http://www.yamaguchy.com/library/jefferson/jefind.html
    unlike you (and your kind) I held in my hand "The Writing of Thomas Jefferson" 9 volumes, 5,400 pages
     
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2013
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  27. honu5050

    honu5050 Mother Lode Found Mother Lode

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    ya have ta have a good reason to get people mad enough to go to war n' y'all can rest assured in the matter of the civil war it was not over the black slaves in the south or north . but that's the story used to cover the continual takeover by the tribe n' their follower's . good news is there are still heavy pockets of resistance world wide. ya want to cut em down ta size ? take 'or don't make the money it takes to keep them moving. war should be waged upon them as they have the people. :cheers:
     
  28. Argent Dragon

    Argent Dragon Site Support Site Mgr Site Supporter

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    The Iroquois Confederacy
    Sojourn Magazine Winter 1998

    "(The Iroquois League) was a model social order in many ways superior to the white man 's culture of the day. Its democratic form of government more nearly approached perfection than any that has been tried to date." -- Elmore Reaman 1967


    Because historians tend to focus on military engagements and changes in national boundaries, our population has little understanding of cultural and social interactions. In an interesting twist of interpretation, Felix Cohen proposed, in a 1952 article called "Americanizing the White Man," That "(historians) have seen America only as an imitation of Europe," but that "the real epic of America is the yet unfinished story of the Americanization of the white man."

    He defines Americanism as largely a product of the influence of Indian culture on the white European settlers. In an equally bold statement, Francis Jennings in The Invasion of America: Indians, Colonialism and The Cant of Conquest (1975) states that "What white (American) society owes to Indian society, as much as to any other source, is the mere fact of its existence."

    Early Euro-Americans voluntarily adopted methods, lifestyles, artifacts, and ideas from the indigenous people, often in order to survive. Indians in America provided half the modern world's domesticated food crops, numerous herbal medicines, clothing, transportation pathways and modes, crafts and artifacts, hygiene methods, and thousands of words including place names and ideas of governance that blended ideals of rugged individuality with concern for the common welfare.

    The Iroquois republic had continuously existed since the 14[SUP]th[/SUP] or 15[SUP]th[/SUP] century. In 1930, Arthur Pound 's Johnson of the Mohawk states, wrote "with the possible exception of the also unwritten British Constitution, deriving from the Magna Carta, the Iroquois Constitution is the longest-existing international constitution in the world." Known ad "The Great Law of Peace," this orally transmitted constitution describes a federal union of five (later six) Indian nations: Mohawk, Onondagam Seneca, Oneida, Cayuga and the Tscarora, adopted in 1715. It was only put in writing in 1915 by Arthur C. Parker, archeologist for the State Museum of New York.

    The Europeans and Iroquois of the mid-18[SUP]th[/SUP] century were on more friendly terms. Many English nobles adopted the lifestyle of Indians and joined their nations. The Treaty Councils brought cultural exchanges in which leaders and statesmen met as equals to diplomatically solve problems and alleviate strained relations. The trade of Great Britain and the peace and prosperity of the colonies was dependent upon this alliance.

    During the era, Benjamin Franklin published twenty-six treaty accounts and represented the state of Pennsylvania as an Indian commissioner. In the pre-Revolutionary period, when he and his friends were advocating a federal union of the colonies, no European model was found to be suitable. Franklin 's contact with the Iroquois influenced many key ideas for a new form of government ; federalism, equality, natural rights, freedom of religion, property rights, etc. At the 1744 treaty council, by Franklin's account, Canassatego, speaker for the great council at Onondaga, recommended that the colonies form a union in common defense under a federal government:

    "We are a powerful Confederacy, and by your observing the same methods our wise forefathers have taken, you will acquire much strength and power; therefore, whatever befalls you, do not fall out with one another."

    In arguing for such a plan, Franklin stressed the fact that the individual nations of the confederacy managed their own internal affairs without interference from the Grand Council.


    Twenty years after Franklin 's plan was defeated at the Albany congress, it reappeared in the Declaration of Independence and the Articles of Confederation. Franklin, Jefferson, John Adams, and George Washington were all familiar with the Iroquois polity. There is also strong scholarly evidence that European philosophers such as Locke, Roussea, More, and Hobbes were familiar with the societies of the American Indians. The integration of this knowledge into their theories of utopias and natural societies further inspired the U.S. founding fathers.

    Even Marx and Engels drew on Iroquois models to support their theories and designs. Engels, like the American revolutionaries a century earlier, was impressed with the Iroquois ' ability to achieve economic equality without coercion and to maintain social consensus without a large state apparatus. It is interesting to note that the roots of American democratic government and communism came from similar ideologies, one emphasizing individualism and the other communal holdings, both key elements held in balance by the Iroquois. Other scholars see a prototype for the 20[SUP]th[/SUP] century United Nations in Iroquois thought and constitution.

    Each of the Iroquois nations was represented to the Confederate Council by a lord of the confederacy and one war chief. Their league included a system of checks and balances, and no action could be taken without the approval of all five Indian nations. Their notions of equality and liberty extended to women as well as men. In war, they never enslaved captives but offered to adopt those willing to accept the Great Law. Their own members could be alienated or expelled by not following the Great Law, and a non-member could be adopted by proposal or invitation with approval from the lords.

    In their constitution, the lords of the confederacy are described as mentors and spiritual guides of the people; their hearts are to be full of peace and goodwill, and their minds full of yearning for the welfare of the people, including those of future generations, their words and actions are to be marked by calm deliberation. They must be honest and have no self-interest; if they become wayward they receive warnings first from the clan women then from the men. If they persist in negative behaviors, they ultimately lose their position and possibly their life. The lords are poorer than the common people. They own few material possessions, and give away presents or plunder acquired by treaty or war. They are above pettiness and corruption, and show no signs of selfishness.

    Those who recognized the wisdom and long history of the Iroquois government did not consider the Indians as mere "savages." Like the Iroquois, Thomas Jefferson believed that public opinion and popular consent were key in maintaining freedom and good government. He held that the power of public opinion was an important reason for the Iroquois ' lack of oppressive government and class differences, and for the power to impeach officials who offended governing principles. Like the Iroquois, he also believed that the best government is the least government.


    In oratory, the Europeans compared the Iroquois with the Greeks and Romans. Both emphasized ethical proof in their arguments. The Indians ended their orations with the words hiro and kone. Hiro means "I have said," and kone was spoken as an exclamation of joy or sorrow, depending on the occasion and circumstances. The French pronunciation of these words together became "Iroquois."

    Unlike Europe, the Iroquois society was matri-lineal. Women owned the land and the status f their lineage. They owned all possessions of their husbands after marriage except their horse and rifle; they took charge off the money, and were the tribe 's educators and communicators of tradition. They female heirs of the lords of the confederacy were called royaneh (noble). The lord of the confederacy was nominated by women =96 selected for qualities of trustworthiness, good character, honesty, faithfulness to the people and the nation, support of the family, and good management of personal affairs. There was not state religion, and the religious rites and festivals of each nation were safeguarded against being disturbed or interrupted. Civil duties were separated from those of the religious leaders, and festivals were held in the longhouses.

    In examining the vision of our forefathers and the many hundreds of years of the Iroquois confederacy 's success, we see how far we have strayed in just over two hundred years. More and more a nation of law and order, with vast class and economic distinctions and political favoritism, we would do well to reeducate ourselves in the values of the Iroquois =96 honesty, good character, honor, the power of the spoken word and public opinion, and the high status of women.

    We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, and that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness. That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed. That, when any form of government becomes destructive to these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or abolish it.

    From the Declaration of Independence.
    Researched and written by Jerri-Jo Idarius

    Source : http://www.lightparty.com/Spirituality/Iroquois.html
     
  29. BarnacleBob

    BarnacleBob GIM Founding Member & Mod. Founding Member Site Mgr Site Supporter

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    I wouldnt be so sure the tribe is wholey responsible for the mischief, as ALL roads do lead to Rome....for instance, the word GOD is also spelled GAUD, these two words are synonamous to one another... The Founders NEVER referenced a deity, except to reference a CREATOR.....

    Was the Tribe responsible for corrupting the language and meaning of GAUD, which is a ROSARY BEAD, and altering the word into GOD? CUI BONO, the Tribe or Rome???

    The Medieval Rosary

    http://www.pomian.demon.co.uk/rosary.htm


    gaud /gôd/noun archaic

    1. a showy and purely ornamental thing.

    gaud (gôd) n. A gaudy or showy ornament or trinket.

    [Middle Englishgaud, gaudi, sing. ofgaudies, large, ornamental beads on a rosary, trinkets, from Medieval Latingaudia, from Latin, pl. ofgaudium, joy (referring to the Joyful Mysteries of the Virgin Mary), fromgaudre, to rejoice; seegu- in Indo-European roots.]

    http://www.thefreedictionary.com/_/dict.aspx?rd=1&word=gaud

    1819

    gaud (gɔd )

    Definitions noun

    a cheap, showy trinket

    Word Origin

    ME gaude, a large bead in a rosary, trinket, prob. ult. < L gaudium, joy

    http://www.collinsdictionary.com/dictionary/american/gaud

    GAUD has 1 sense: 1. cheap showy jewelry or ornament on clothing Familiarity information: GAUD used as a noun is very rare.

    Dictionary entry details

    • GAUD (noun)

    Sense 1

    Meaning: Cheap showy jewelry or ornament on clothing Classified under: Nouns denoting man-made objects Synonyms: fallal; gaud; gewgaw; trinket; bangle; bauble; novelty Hypernyms ("gaud" is a kind of...): adornment (a decoration of color or interest that is added to relieve plainness) Holonyms ("gaud" is a member of...): trinketry (trinkets and other ornaments of dress collectively)

    http://www.audioenglish.org/dictionary/gaud.htm

    Gaud[L. gaudeo, to rejoice.] To exult; to rejoice. GAUD, n. [L. gaudium.] An ornament; something worn for adorning the person; a fine thing.

    http://sorabji.com/1828/words/g/gaud.html

    gaud (plural gauds)

    1. a cheap showy trinket
    2. (obsolete) trick; jest; sport
    3. (obsolete) deceit; fraud; artifice


    http://en.m.wiktionary.org/wiki/gaud
     
  30. BarnacleBob

    BarnacleBob GIM Founding Member & Mod. Founding Member Site Mgr Site Supporter

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    The Tribe uses the word "Elohim" which appears some 2,500 times in the Old Testament.

    The tetragrammaton, the four-letter name of Gaud/God, YHWH, pronounced "Adonai", appears 6,646 times in the Old Testament.

    "According to Strong's Concordance, the term Gaud/God is mentioned 4473 times in 3893 verses in the KJV."

    Seems logical to me that the Tribe has always possessed and used their specific names for a/the Creator.... while the translations of their texts were altered by the Roman Church providing for a name or concept that fit their symbolism already in use.... from that the Rosary bead, GAUD emerges interchangeably as GOD....

    It is not logical to lay such responsibility for this upon the Tribe, for even the symbolic Christ referred to Gaud/God as the Father, not a rosary bead or other man made symbols!

    Further, the entire concept of HELL is a complete fantasy foisted upon Western Civilization by the Roman Church..... how many lives have been lost because of the HELL lie? And the Tribe is/was not responsible for that one either....!

    gaud - trick or practical joke

    http://phrontistery.info/g.html

    Once again the footsteps dont lead to Jerusalem, the path leads to Rome.
     
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2013
  31. BarnacleBob

    BarnacleBob GIM Founding Member & Mod. Founding Member Site Mgr Site Supporter

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    More Vatican mischief...??? The American Aristocracy therefore employed "CREATOR."

    Gad is a Syrian or Canaanite deity of good luck or fortune. In Hebrew, it is written GD, but with Massoretic vowel-pointing, it is "Gad." Other Scriptural references to a similar deity, also written GD, have a vowel-pointing giving us "Gawd" or "God." Gad, or Gawd is identified with Jupiter, the Sky-deity or the Sun-deity.

    http://assemblyoftrueisrael.com/IsJesusGod/thewordgod.html

    GAWD/GOD
    a written form of a pronunciation of the word "God," used humorously for expressing surprise, fear or shock


    Main Entry: gawd
    archaic variant of gaud
    http://i.word.com/idictionary/gawd

    GAWD
    an informal way of writing the word god, when used in expressions of fear, surprise, etc

    Gawd

    Pronunciation: /gɔːd/

    exclamation informalGod (used for emphasis or to express surprise, anger, etc.):

    http://www.oxforddictionaries.com/us/definition/english/Gawd
     
  32. BarnacleBob

    BarnacleBob GIM Founding Member & Mod. Founding Member Site Mgr Site Supporter

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    Freemasons & the U.S. Constitution

    The purpose of this webpage is to present information about Freemasons and the U.S. Constitution. Most of the information comes from a booklet, Masonic Membership of the Signers of the Constitution of the United States, published by the Masonic Service Association, and written by Bro. Ronald E. Heaton. It was originally published in 1962, reprinted in 1986.

    SUMMARY: 39 men signed the U.S. Constitution 13 (33%) were Freemasons

    http://bessel.org/constmas.htm
     
  33. BarnacleBob

    BarnacleBob GIM Founding Member & Mod. Founding Member Site Mgr Site Supporter

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    Last edited: Dec 8, 2013
  34. BarnacleBob

    BarnacleBob GIM Founding Member & Mod. Founding Member Site Mgr Site Supporter

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    Presented herein is an interesting story about a Constitutional signer, proving when it comes to .gov they are ALL used for the same purpose regardless of their classifications or titles.

    "the more things change, the more they stay the same!"

    http://scripophily.net/rar17newhamu.html
     
  35. honu5050

    honu5050 Mother Lode Found Mother Lode

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    A slick bunch of shysters whether in Israel or Rome IMHO. :Reading:
     
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  36. BarnacleBob

    BarnacleBob GIM Founding Member & Mod. Founding Member Site Mgr Site Supporter

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    AGREED..... !!!

    Treaty of Paris (1783)

    The American War for Independence (1775-83) was actually a world conflict, involving not only the United States and Great Britain but also France, Spain, and the Netherlands. The peace process brought a vaguely formed, newly born United States into the arena of international diplomacy, playing against the largest, most sophisticated, and most established powers on earth.

    http://www.ourdocuments.gov/doc.php?flash=false&doc=6


    Treaty of Paris 1783

    In the Name of the most Holy & undivided Trinity.

    It having pleased the Divine Providence to dispose the Hearts of the most Serene and most Potent Prince George the Third, by the Grace of God, King of Great Britain, France, and Ireland, Defender of the Faith, Duke of Brunswick and Lunebourg, Arch- Treasurer and
    Prince Elector of the Holy Roman Empire etc.. and of the United States of America
    ,

    Article 8th, Treaty of Paris 1783

    "The Navigation of the river Mississippi, from its source to the Ocean, shall forever remain free and open to the Subjects of Great Britain and the Citizens of the United States."
     
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2013
  37. BarnacleBob

    BarnacleBob GIM Founding Member & Mod. Founding Member Site Mgr Site Supporter

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    arch-treasurer

    The term archtreasurer refers to a chief treasurer. Commonly, it is specifically used for the great treasurer of the Holy Roman Empire. ...

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arch-treasurer

    prince elector

    The prince-electors of the Holy Roman Empire were the members of the electoral college of the Holy Roman Empire, having since the 13th century the privilege of electing the King of the Romans or, from the middle of the 16th century onwards, directly the Holy Roman Emperor. ...

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prince-Elector

    The Matrix, Rome is everwhere and nowhere!

    QUESTION: The Declaration of Independence 1776 declared independence from the King & his corporations, which created the Articles of Confederation & Perpetual Union, however this does not explain the SECOND declaration of independence contained in the Constitution 1787, to wit:

    Done in convention by the unanimous consent of the states present the seventeenth day of September in the year of our Lord one thousand seven hundred and eighty seven and of the independence of the United States of America the twelfth.

    QUESTION: Who or what were they declaring independence from in 1787? Could the answer be "THE Holy Roman Empire???"

    QUESTION: The King states in Treaty of Paris 1783 that he is KING of England, France & Ireland.... Which means if the King was King of England & also King of France, he was financing both sides of the war.... he thus controlled whom would win or lose the battle for independence of North America.... WHY then did he ALLOW the colonists to gain their independence? Not only is he King of England, but also Prince of Holy Roman Empire, which means he could have easily crushed the rebellion.... LOGICALLY, the he & his associates WANTED the rebellion to succeed.... but WHY???

    QUESTION: Who is the Prince-Elector of the Holy Roman Empire TODAY??? Its certainly NOT the Pope!
     
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2013
  38. BarnacleBob

    BarnacleBob GIM Founding Member & Mod. Founding Member Site Mgr Site Supporter

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    THE HIDDEN EMPIRE

    "This corporate empire of 3 city states controls the world economically, through London’s inner city, militarily through the District of Columbia & spiritually through the Vatican."


    http://www.goldismoney2.com/showthread.php?56616-THE-HIDDEN-EMPIRE-The-Vatican-City

    " From the days of Spartacus-Weishaupt to those of Karl Marx, and down to Trotsky (Russia), Bela Kun (Hungary), Rosa Luxembourg (Germany), and Emma Goldman (United States), this world-wide conspiracy for the overthrow of civilization and for the reconstitution of society on the basis of arrested development, of envious malevolence, and impossible equality, has been steadily growing. It played... a definitely recognizable part in the tragedy of the French Revolution. It has been the mainspring of every subversive movement during the Nineteenth Century; and now at last this band of extraordinary personalities from the underworld of the great cities of Europe and America have gripped the Russian people by the hair of their heads and have become practically the undisputed masters of that enormous empire." --Winston Churchill

    Russia: The Third Rome & Masters of Jerusalem


    http://gnosticwarrior.com/russia.html#comment-3641

    I cannot vouch for the accuracy of the above... but the article certainly contains many, many hints into the interpretation of Churchills quotation!
     
  39. Argent Dragon

    Argent Dragon Site Support Site Mgr Site Supporter

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    Benjamin Franklin on the Iroquois League, in a letter to James Parker, 1751

    In this letter, Benjamin Franklin, whose famous statement “Join or Die” later galvanized colonial union and the fight for independence from the British, states that his inspiration for this came from the six tribes of the Iroquois Nation, for whom union was also advantageous.
    It would be a strange thing if Six Nations of ignorant savages should be capable of forming a scheme for such an union, and be able to execute it in such a manner as that it has subsisted ages and appears indissoluble; and yet that a like union should be impracticable for ten or a dozen English colonies, to whom it is more necessary and must be more advantageous, and who cannot be supposed to want an equal understanding of their interests.


    Credit: Benjamin Franklin on the Iroquois League, in a letter to James Parker, 1751.
     
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