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For the members who worship a religion, tell me your opinion on this :

Discussion in 'Topical Discussions (In Depth)' started by HardTruth, Sep 1, 2017.



  1. arminius

    arminius Gold Member Gold Chaser Site Supporter ++

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    Yeeeouch...
     
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  2. Surface

    Surface Seeker Seeker

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    Rap stinks, I mean if you can't sing why are you irritating my ears? If you can't play the tuba, would you instead fart and irritate my nose too? Rap is crap, but I guess it is a release valve for passive aggression against singing.
     
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  3. Son of Gloin

    Son of Gloin Gold Member Gold Chaser Site Supporter ++

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    I think you hit that nail just right, squarely on it's head. Driven home, exactly.
     
  4. HardTruth

    HardTruth Silver Miner Seeker

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    Its a discussion forum . I pop in and out about every 2-3 years to talk about the more controversial and delicate topics. I figure some of yas may get bored with the endless faulty predictions of $200 silver and $5000 gold .
     
  5. Son of Gloin

    Son of Gloin Gold Member Gold Chaser Site Supporter ++

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    Yep.
     
  6. HardTruth

    HardTruth Silver Miner Seeker

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    The poor religious folk have been predicting the end of the world and the return of their messiah, for over 2000 years . That's 1 hell of a track record of errors . How do they deal with such a long track record of idiocy ? They simply ignore how wrong they have been, and continue to make the same faulty predictions for next year. They will use the same old religious claims of " THERE SHALL BE WARS AND RUMOUR OF WARS , as a indication their messiah is returning soon and the rapture will begin.

    Its difficult to repair a deluded religious mindset , no matter how wrong they have been over eons.

    Theres a certain sadness in knowing that many religious people, actually spend their whole lives, sitting back, hoping for rapture, doom and gloom and the end of the world. They wish these horrors to happen in a need for them to be able to finally say " I TOLD YA SO " .

    Does it bother you in the least, that the cult you associate yourself with, has been so wrong, for so long ?
     
  7. phoneman

    phoneman Silver Member Silver Miner

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    1st Corinthians 1:27 -God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise. Chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty, It is IMPOSSIBLE to please God without faith. Hebrews 11:6.
     
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  8. stonedywankanobe

    stonedywankanobe Gold Member Gold Chaser

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    Not in this lifetyme bub. First and foremost this is a silver discussion forum, everything else gold included, plays second fiddle. IMHO
     
  9. keef

    keef Пальто Crude Platinum Bling

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    Liquid or Capsule? Hmmmmmmmm

    [​IMG]
    What IS the Hard Truth???
     
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  10. Rollie Free

    Rollie Free Midas Member Midas Member

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    Hard Truth,
    I think you phrasing your questions and scenarios in such a way it kind of tips the boat. I see a cynic, but I think I can handle that as I am one also.

    When you pigeonhole religion as all being o e and the same I think you are going off course.

    Like it or not Christianity is unique. We do not believe your premise that we must do good deeds or we'll be eternally separated from God. Our focus is not on works but on forgiveness for our shortcomings, or sin.
    If one were on their deathbed and their life was a horrible, murderous affair, a contrite heart begging forgiveness and an acceptance of Christ's salvation would enter them into the kingdom of God. Some call that unfair or ridiculous, I find it beautiful. I find it that way because I was forgiven the same way. There is no keeping of tabs because our works are as dirty rags to God.
    Good works are a response to our salvation and they are not our own, we don't earn anything for it. They are the domain of God's influence, namely The Holy Spirit.
    Now think about this, God gave me the body, the intellect, and the compassion to do good works and the Spirit to direct that. Where does my credit come in? I created none of that. That is why we say all glory to God.
    One can do good works for all kinds of reasons that have little to do with empathy. Self preservation, an expectation of reward (sound familiar), or to dispense of guilt. It can appear selfless but be a selfish act.
    Anyway, I wanted to set that straight.
     
  11. Rollie Free

    Rollie Free Midas Member Midas Member

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    Everyone's favorite commercial.

    Man:Hey honey, what say we take off all our clothes and sit outside in separate bath tubs?

    Spouse: Do what? What the hell? What's wrong with you?
     
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  12. HardTruth

    HardTruth Silver Miner Seeker

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    That's only half of the religious equation . It is the other half that goes along with your above statement, that is absurd, evil and not the mindset of a divine god ...here is that other half.

    One can be the most loving, caring, honest compassionate and unselfish person on earth, but they still deserve and will be sent to a eternity of pain and torture, if they did not properly worship the 1 correct religion/ God.

    It is this sick dogma that is embraced by most religious folk, that is beyond faulty , IMHO.

    If had a choice between spending my afterlife with :

    1. a mass murderer , liar who asked for forgiveness from a god/religion on his deathbed
    or
    2. a person who spent their who life on earth being honest, moral, charitable, and did not need religion or phony gods to do those acts,

    I would want to be in the company of the 2nd person every time.
     
  13. Son of Gloin

    Son of Gloin Gold Member Gold Chaser Site Supporter ++

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    Your most honest, moral, ethical person is a fiction. He's not you, he's not me. He does not exist. You accuse all of us warped, indoctrinated religionists of believing in a fictional demented God, but your superman doesn't exist, never has existed and never will exist on his or her own free will. Every human being falls very short of moral perfection. There's no way around it. As hard as it may be to believe, God loves your mass murdering liar as much as he loves you or me. He wishes the best for all of us and that means a repentant heart and a relationship with that repentant person. You've twisted the whole idea of God's will and so called demands into a complete made up HardTruth mind trip. You haven't gotten any part of right, yet. Do some reading, study on it, meditate on it and come back with an open mind and searching heart and you might actually be able to ask the right questions. Otherwise, you're just projecting hate and anger and feeding your own fantasy.
     
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  14. HardTruth

    HardTruth Silver Miner Seeker

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    Just like your fictional religion and fictional divine God that murders people in the most painful ways { flood, fire, plagues} then sends their souls to eternal torture and pain ? Your god likes to give the " double whammy of pain...ROFL.
     
  15. itsamess

    itsamess Silver Member Silver Miner

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    HT please name one #2 person please.
     
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  16. HardTruth

    HardTruth Silver Miner Seeker

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    Larry Silverstein.
     
  17. itsamess

    itsamess Silver Member Silver Miner

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    Can't can ya

    HT= One tin soldier fantasy
     
    Last edited: Sep 2, 2017
  18. Bottom Feeder

    Bottom Feeder Hypophthalmichthys molitrix Gold Chaser Site Supporter

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    Jeeze, you guys much to serious for mr. bottom feeder. So here's my mantra:

    Here’s to Cheating, Stealing, Fighting And Drinking.
    If you cheat,
    May you cheat death.
    If you steal,
    May you steal a woman’s heart.
    If you fight,
    May you fight for a brother.
    And if you drink,
    May you drink with me.​

    BF


     
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  19. HardTruth

    HardTruth Silver Miner Seeker

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    I don't recall saying I have met such a person . , It was a hypothetical question posed to culties who claim even the most moral, honest person on earth, is not good enough for heaven without them properly worshipping the 1 correct religion or god.

    I understand your religious belief, that even if a person tells 1 little lie in their whole lifetime{ while doing 99% good, moral and charitable deeds} , that alone is enough for God to send them to a eternity of torture and pain UNLESS, the play the religious lottery and worship the 1 religion/god properly.

    I doubt a divine God would think this way, but it is the basis for most religious peoples beliefs.,
     
  20. HardTruth

    HardTruth Silver Miner Seeker

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    I don't recall saying I have met such a person . , It was a hypothetical question posed to culties who claim even the most moral, honest person on earth, is not good enough for heaven without them properly worshipping the 1 correct religion or god.

    I understand your religious belief, that even if a person tells 1 little lie in their whole lifetime{ while doing 99% good, moral and charitable deeds} , that 1 little lie alone , is enough for God to send them to a eternity of torture and pain UNLESS, the play the religious lottery and worship the 1 religion/god properly.

    I doubt a divine God would think this way, but it is the basis for most religious peoples beliefs.,
     
  21. HardTruth

    HardTruth Silver Miner Seeker

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    If the goy cant trust this this guy, who can we trust ? larry.png
     
  22. ttazzman

    ttazzman Midas Member Midas Member Site Supporter

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    I am not sure how any Human could ever understand how a "Devine Creator/God" thinks or make judgements of such to do so would to be to try to put ourselves at "Its" level

    All Religion inspired by god or not is put through the filter of Human(s) and i think we can as humans however judge the motives and flaws of humanity and understand all dogma could be inherently flawed due to its human filter

    Seems ignorant to me for a group of flawed humans to congregate and argue about "Gods" thoughts and intents
     
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  23. HardTruth

    HardTruth Silver Miner Seeker

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    yes, I agree . I still like to debate with religious people though. In fact a few of my best friends are very religious. I don't hate religious people, but many of their twisted religious beliefs, baffle me.
     
  24. HardTruth

    HardTruth Silver Miner Seeker

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    So let me see if I got the math correct.

    estimations :

    7.5 billion people on earth
    about 2 billion claim to be Christians { yeah , id bet maybe 10% of them truly behave in a Christianly manner }

    so that leaves us with 5.5 billion non Christians. They all deserve to rot eternally in hell ? Man, hell is gonna be crowded.
     
  25. ttazzman

    ttazzman Midas Member Midas Member Site Supporter

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    LOL...so the good cells and cancer cells are argueing between themselves on which are good and which are bad based on cell level logic.....all the while the "supreme being" is gona sort them out based on "its" logic at some point in time......all the while those cells are trying to make spacial judgements on how many are going where and if there is enough room for them......

    "grin"
     
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  26. HardTruth

    HardTruth Silver Miner Seeker

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    Well, I wanna get the numbers sorted out , so I know if I go to hell or heaven, how crowded it shall be and who I'm gonna be hanging out with for eternity. Not much different then buying a house in a new neighborhood :]
     
  27. ttazzman

    ttazzman Midas Member Midas Member Site Supporter

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    LOL....while your working that out....i am going to go do some work on my deer stand...and prep some fishing gear...so i can enjoy this wonderful weekend given to me by the "supreme being"
     
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  28. Aurumag

    Aurumag Dimly lit. Highly reflective Midas Member Site Supporter

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    I'm so pleased to see religious discussions that are not being moved into the members only forum.

    To the question in the OP:

    First, I unashamedly claim to be one of the "insane Christian culties" you regularly rail against.

    That being prefaced, I will use the Word himself to back my beliefs, as I typically do, and I will paraphrase for the benefit of those who despise the written Word of God.

    When asked by a lawyer to pin-point the greatest of the commandments, Jesus replied with The First.

    Love god. Love your neighbor.
     
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  29. HardTruth

    HardTruth Silver Miner Seeker

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    God wrote the bible himself ? Once again, you base your beliefs on fallible humans from eons ago and present it as though it is actual fact.
    Yes, I know the reply..." the humans that wrote it, were inspired by God " ..but even that is not trustworthy or provable and even if it was true, then you have thousands of years of man interfering with that written word.. and mutating and transforming it and molding it to suit different agendas.

    Do any of us peon humans, actually have the original bible that God supposedly inspired ? How can anyone claim that a text written thousands of years ago, has actually remained COMPLETELY intact and its original form ?

    Are you not actually believing in a complex religious text that has more then likely been altered HEAVILY from its original state ?
     
  30. ttazzman

    ttazzman Midas Member Midas Member Site Supporter

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    ...so .... you cant prove its altered....but demand he prove its not altered......you make a subjective judgment on the subject and expect him to accept it but dont accept his right to judge it the way he sees fit ...

    come on ...you certainly can make a more intellectual argument that that.....this is one step up from grade school name calling
     
  31. hammerhead

    hammerhead Not just a screen name Gold Chaser

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  32. hammerhead

    hammerhead Not just a screen name Gold Chaser

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  33. hammerhead

    hammerhead Not just a screen name Gold Chaser

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  34. hammerhead

    hammerhead Not just a screen name Gold Chaser

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    I suggest that man is humble enough to realize he is not the center of the universe. Therefore he throughout the ages has thought that there could be a divine creator.
     
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  35. HardTruth

    HardTruth Silver Miner Seeker

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    sure it can be proved the bible has been altered..there are numerous versions of it.
    besides, since when have we been able to trust the human race , to keep a lengthy text in its original format, for thousands of years , especially when the circulation of such written material, was created in massive quantities and distributed over eons, with countless different printings.
     
  36. HardTruth

    HardTruth Silver Miner Seeker

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    I have no issue with thinking there is a divine , loving creator. My issue is when that entity is then labeled with traits of a faulty, undivine entity. Murder millions of people thru drowning them.. burning them alive in fire , eternal damnation of their souls just because
    they did not chose the 1 supposed correct religion to worship ? THAT AINT NO DIVINE MORAL LOVING GOD...IT IS A VENGEFUL, LUNATIC, MURDEROUS GOD.
     
  37. hammerhead

    hammerhead Not just a screen name Gold Chaser

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    I truly relate to you. Having been raised catholic and after losing my father to cancer when I was not even a teenager (he was 55) I stayed with some relatives that were born again christians. Yup, God's gunna get you for that. Repent. Turn your heart over to Jesus and be saved. I was baptized in the holy spirit and even have spoken in tongues. Turned to alcohol and drugs and was a very confused person for more than half my life. Ended up having children. Not planned but that gave me a reason to look at life in a more meaningful way. Ended up in a 12 step recovery program, learned that I have character defects and I'm not a defective character. And guess what, everybody has character defects. Also learned what spirituality is. I did ask for direction not for specifics. Even so, I cannot say there is or is not a God.

    There is no doubt religion can be manipulative. I could carry on like you do and try to convince anybody that would care to listen how wrong I think they are. But at the end of the day, it is up to the individual to decide what is right or wrong for them. That is their freedom. May you find peace within yourself and let the whirling dervishes whirl.
     
  38. hammerhead

    hammerhead Not just a screen name Gold Chaser

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    I just realized that Sunny Hard Sunshine is Jim Morrison risen from the grave. All bow before him.

     
  39. ttazzman

    ttazzman Midas Member Midas Member Site Supporter

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    i would contend that there is no way to know if something is altered without having access to the original texts (could in fact have been multiple versions of the original texts)

    its human nature to find a way to manipulate others to your will, religious dogma can be one of the many many ways to do that...obviously you have had a bad experience with someone(s) where this occurred and seek to return the favor in kind to someone else......life will be easier and more fulfilling if you seek what is truth for you instead of seeking to brow beat others

    Hammerhead ....very well said !!!
     
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  40. bb28

    bb28 Silver Member Silver Miner

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    There are a lot of aspects of the bible that can be debated, but the text consistency is generally not one of them.

    A few reference points:

    - The dead sea scrolls proved remarkable accuracy in the Old Testament.

    - The bible is the only holy book I know of that is written in a holographic way. It refers back to itself, is both linear and non-linear and if you remove chapters or books from it, you loose depth but not details. When you see all of the links in the bible to itself, it makes it very difficult to change the text. This is something you can only see with lots of in-depth study, but it shows the failure of perverted translations because they end up with multiple, multiple links that lead nowhere or become nonsense.

    - Read the book of Isiah. It is like a bible inside a bible.

    - Ivan Panin's work (https://www.biblebelievers.org.au/panin2.htm). To my knowledge, nobody has ever debated him or disproved his work. The man found checksums in the bible and proved them mathematically to be faithful. This is not a bible code. The work in itself is rather remarkable. The man found faith in Jesus Christ as a Russian atheist based on the mathematical checksums in the original Hebrew.

    - Another point that nobody brings up is how well the bible explains the modern-day world. It also condemns Catholisim and the vast majority of the modern-day church. One would think a religion practicing something completely at odds with their own holy book would at least update their holy book, but it simply does not happen.

    bb
     
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