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Gunman In Combat Dress Goes Berserk At Texas Church

Discussion in 'Coffee Shack (Daily News/Economy)' started by searcher, Nov 5, 2017.



  1. gnome

    gnome Platinum Bling Platinum Bling

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    Do you just believe what you read on the internet without question?
    As the link above clearly shows, there is clickbait industry dedicated solely to posting fake quotes from ANTIFA. If you believe that ANTIFA says they are going to walk into churches and open fire, you have fallen for propaganda designed to get you riled up. Who benefits, besides the clickbait farms?
     
  2. Goldhedge

    Goldhedge Moderator Site Mgr Site Supporter

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    AF CYA

    McCain: Armed Services Committee Will Investigate Failure to Report Gunman’s Convictions


    By Susan Jones | November 7, 2017 | 5:42 AM EST


    [​IMG]
    First Baptist Church, Sutherland Springs, Texas (Screen grab/YouTube)

    (CNSNews.com) – The man who shot and killed 26 people at a Sutherland Springs, Texas church should never have been allowed to legally purchase a gun, but he did – four times – because the Air Force failed to report his domestic violence convictions and bad conduct discharge to federal law enforcement.


    In a statement issued on Monday, Sen. John McCain (R-Ariz.), the chairman of the Senate Armed Services Committee, promised to look into it:

    The Air Force has acknowledged that after court martialing and convicting the perpetrator on charges of domestic assault, it failed to report the conviction to the FBI.

    The Senate Armed Services Committee will conduct rigorous oversight of the Department's investigation into the circumstances that led to this failure. It's critical that each of the military services take the steps necessary to ensure that similar mistakes have not occurred and will not occur in the future.

    The Air Force also is reviewing how it handled the criminal records of 26-year-old Devin Patrick Kelley.


    The Senate Armed Services Committee will conduct rigorous oversight of the Department's investigation into the circumstances that led to this failure. It's critical that each of the military services take the steps necessary to ensure that similar mistakes have not occurred and will not occur in the future.

    The Air Force also is reviewing how it handled the criminal records of 26-year-old Devin Patrick Kelley.

    In a statement released on Monday, Air Force spokesperson Ann Stefanik said Kelly was convicted on two charges of domestic violence against his wife and his stepson at his 2012 court martial. Press reports said he pointed a loaded gun at his former wife and cracked his stepson’s skull.​


    He served 12 months in confinement before being released from the Air Force with a Bad Conduct Discharge in 2014.

    “Federal law prohibited him from buying or possessing firearms after this conviction,” Stefanik said. “Initial information indicates that Kelley’s domestic violence offense was not entered into the National Criminal Information Center database by the

    Holloman Air Force Base Office of Special Investigations.”

    The National Criminal Information Center is one of the databases checked by the national instant background check system.

    Stefanik said the Air Force will conduct a “comprehensive review” of its databases to ensure that records in other cases have been reported correctly. The Air Force has also requested that the Department of Defense Inspector General review records and procedures across the Department of Defense.

    https://www.cnsnews.com/news/articl..._medium=CNS&utm_campaign=N-mccain-convictions
     
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  3. Ensoniq

    Ensoniq Midas Member Midas Member Site Supporter ++

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    Touching story of the grandma, already shot in the legs 4 times.

    was laying there as the ahole made a second pass around the Church hitting those again that didn't die

    As he was approaching her to finish her off, that's when Mr. AR15 shot him and forced the end of the attack
     
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  4. Ensoniq

    Ensoniq Midas Member Midas Member Site Supporter ++

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    Ted Cruz says legislation could have prevented Texas shooting – but Democrats pulled the plug
    [​IMG]
    In an interview on Fox News about the awful Texas shooting that took 26 lives, Senator Ted Cruz (R-Texas) said that he had introduced legislation with Sen. Chuck Grassley (R-Ia.) in 2013 that could have prevented the horror, but Democrats filibustered it.

    Here’s what he said:

    “We could have prevented this,” Cruz said, “in 2013 in the wake of Sandy Hook, I joined with Chuck Grassley, we introduced legislation that was called the Grassley-Cruz legislation. And it was aggressive legislation targeting felons and violent criminals to stop them from getting guns.”

    “There were a couple of elements of that legislation that were critical,” he explained. “One, it mandated that federal agencies, including the Air Force, report to the NCIS because that was a problem back then.”

    “But two, and this is an even more critical piece,” he added. “If it had been reported to the background database, when he went into academy to buy these weapons, he lied on the forms – that is a felony to lie on those forms.”

    “The Obama administration didn’t prosecute those cases,” he continued. “In 2010, 40,000 felons and fugitives lied and illegally tried to purchase guns – they prosecuted only 44 of them.”
     
  5. Irons

    Irons Deep Sixed Site Supporter Mother Lode

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    You defend proven domestic terrorists that attack women and old people and burn property because they don't like the president? Screw the propaganda these soros ninjas are on film in dozens of locations doing just that.

    That is really fucked up man.


    .
     
  6. searcher

    searcher Mother Lode Found Site Supporter ++ Mother Lode

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    Protecting Your Church and Family After Texas Church Shootings | Active Self Protection Extra
    Active Self Protection Extra



    Published on Nov 8, 2017
    In light of the mass killing at First Baptist Church in Sutherland Springs, TX, I hope to encourage all of us to consider lessons learned about protecting ourselves, our churches, our families, and our nation from mass killings like these.
     
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  7. Joe King

    Joe King Gold Member Gold Chaser

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    Not to be nit picky or anything, but these two accounts don't seem to add up. In his interview by Crowder, Mr Willeford said he first saw the shooter outside in front of his vehicle and that he only had a handgun, but the victim who I presume was inside the church says that the shooter was still going around shooting people inside the church with a rifle when he was shot by our hero. If so, how could he be outside in front of his own vehicle when first engaged by Mr Willeford? Seems like two very different accounts by people who should have similar stories.
     
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  8. Goldhedge

    Goldhedge Moderator Site Mgr Site Supporter

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    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    I can recall vividly watching the tape of Walter Cronkite as he announced the death of JFK. Cronkite was fighting with everything he had to maintain himself during the report and he did so with great poise although he was visibily shaken. I had my Walter Cronkite moment, and I failed, as I interviewed a citizen from Sutherland Springs, Texas. I know many people in the media relish the thought being the first to break a story and they can do so, under great pressure with professionalism. I am not made that way. Walter Cronkite. I am not. I freely confess that the interview I conducted on the facts surrounding the mass murder in Texas haunt me. I awakened this morning having a nightmare about the events. I hope I am never in this position again to where I have to report such profound human tragedy.

    In the late evening of November 8, 2017, I interviewed Vonda Smith from Sutherland Springs, Texas. Vonda’s husband origainlly reached out to me on Facebook and told me that the “real story” was not being told regarding the tragic events that took place on November 5th.

    The Interview Has Been Sabotaged
    I have the raw tape of the interview and it was ready for distribution. However, my files have been infiltrated and strange music, the likes of what I have never heard, has been embedded into the recording of the interview, making the listening to the exchange between Vonda and myself nearly impossible to decipher. I am having an individual working on removing the music track and they think they can do it, however, it is going to take time. In the meantime, I do not feel that I can wait to get this information out.

    Last night, I was comparing notes with Paul Preston of Agenda 21 Radio and he advised me to get this information out as soon as possible because it was not safe for either Vonda nor myelf to be the only ones in possession of the information revealed that was contained in our audio recording. I agree with Paul’s assessment, therefore, I am going to recount the interview from my perspective and am not going to wait to the release of the “repaired” audio file. When the file is restored, I will post it here as an update.

    Chris Ward’s Family
    Very early in the tragedy, local media aired a report that had identified the shooter as Chris Ward. This was repeated far and wide and dominated social media. I was reporting on the fact that Kelly had been killed and was recounting the contents of his deleted Facebook page when this interview began to cross my email, multiple times anming Mr. Ward as the assailant. He was not!

    All of us in the media owe Mr. Ward profound apology. Mr. Ward lost most of his family in the tragedy. As fate would have it, he was home sleeping while his family was at the ill-fated church because he had worked very late the night before. It was Mr. Wards brave wife, Joann, who was the mom that laid over her children, trying to protect them as, this animal assassin fired several bullets into the mother killing her and two of the three children. I personally extend my profound and heartfelt condolescences to Mr. Ward and his loved ones for their horrific loss.

    Joann’s aunt has set up a “Go Fund Me” account to help Chris with the associated expenses . Here is the link if you wish to support Chris War and his loved ones.

    https://www.gofundme.com/JOANNWARD

    From the Go Fund Me page:

    “We lost my niece Joann Ward and two of her little girls in the Sutherland Springs shooting. Their youngest boy is still in unknown medical condition as he was shot 4-5 times but made it to the hospital. Joann was the most wonderful mom any child could wish for and her children were always laughing and just loving life. She leaves behind a husband and two other children that were in the church but survived the attack.

    I can imagine the costs burden on her surviving husband and family. Any contribution you can make will go directly to help with funeral costs, medical costs and other losses due to this horrific tragedy. A fund for the two surviving children, Ryland, age 5 and Rihanna, age 9 will be set up for their needs with the remainder of all donations raised. Thank you. ”
    [​IMG]
    Beloved mother Joann Ward.

    [​IMG]
    "We lost the two middle children above, Emily and Brooke.”

    This Sunday night, on The Common Sense Show, I am going to be assisting Joann’s aunt in raising the needed funds.

    The Invasion of the Body Snatchers
    Vonda Smith’s description of the events immediately following the tragedy made it clear that there was no intent on the part of the authorities to preserve the intergrity of the crime scene. Apparently, “the authorities” were the FBI who seemed to make it to this town at light speed. Paul Preston told me that he saw news clips of men in FBI jackets that were on the scene in less than an hour following the shooting. Yet, there was crime scene integrity. According to Vonda, the only thing that the FBI cared about was to quickly get the bodies out of the church. This flies in the fact of “normal” crime scene investigations. Vonda recounted two stories of where the crime scene was invaded and nobody was guarding the evidence so to speak. Most telling was the fact that many of the bodies never went to the morgue for an autopsy.

    Following the gruesome event, the authorities put out an all-call for people to send photos of the victims to the authorites for purposes of identifcation. One person was shown a photo of tattoos and this was used as the means to identify a dead person. The vast majority of the family member of the victims, as of Wednesday evening have not been allowed to identify their fallen relatives.

    Vonda related the story of one family that was dictated to by the FBI what kind of funeral they were going to have. According to Vonda, the FBI told one family how much of the body they would be permitted to view. Additionally, the family was told whether the casket would remain open or closed.

    An Overreach of Jurisdictional Authority
    Despite the fact that ISIS has taken credit for the massacre at Sutherland Springs, the FBI has stated that this was not a terrorist event. Despite the fact that the original reports stated that Kelly was an “avowed athiest”, this was not a hate crime involving Christians. Despite the fact that myself and others have revealed the Kelly has a decided Antifa affiliation and identified with ISIS, the FBI categorized and characterized this event as a “mental health” event. The FBI is wrong and just with the Vegas massacre, they are covering up the facts of the case.

    The FBI needs to badly answer a question. If this is not a terrorist event, then why does the FBI have jurisdictional authority? This is a matter for the local sheriff. Why does the FBI have the right to determine what kind of casket and the degree of body exposure the victims will have? Why, now four days, after the event, have the vast majority of victims not been identified? In fact, Vonda clearly stated that the FBI was throwing deliberate roadblocks into body identification by demanding that the family had to have both the social security card and the birth certificate of the victim. Ask yourself a question America: How many of you could meet that burden? And when have you ever heard of such nonsense when it comes to proper body identification?

    A Chilling Account
    Vonda recounted the eyewitness testimony of a nine year old child who survived the attack. The girl clearly and personally told Vonda that the assailant put a gun to his own head and shot himself. Vonda further stated that the girl later repeated the fact that the assailant put a gun to his head but did not repeat the fact that he shot himself. I would say it is a safe bet that the girl was accurately describing a suicide. There would be no reason for the assailant to put a gun to his head and then not fire.

    As It Was In Vegas, The Official Narrative Does Not Add Up
    Paul Preston has a source that lives 3 miles from the scene of the crime and he is getting the EXACT same details as what Vonda described in that there are issues with the removal of the bodies, identification and crime scene integrity.

    I have taken the facts as Vonda has described them and posed these facts to people I consider experts. Here is what they have universally concluded:

    1. There were multiple shooters
    2. The reason that the idenfication of the bodies is being delayed is so the wounds can be surgically altered as much as possible. This is to conceal the fact that these people were likely shot with two different guns.
    3. Further, the restricted viewing aspect associated with the caskets at burial is to prevent people from seeing the conditions of the bodies as much as possible for the same reasons of concealment.


    The Interview Has Been Restored

     
    Last edited: Nov 12, 2017
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  9. Goldhedge

    Goldhedge Moderator Site Mgr Site Supporter

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  10. Ensoniq

    Ensoniq Midas Member Midas Member Site Supporter ++

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    I've got no idea but here's the source I was summarizing. It's a first hand account

    As Farida Brown lay on the floor in the last row of pews in Sutherland Springs First Baptist Church, the 73-year-old woman felt certain she would be the next one killed.

    And she almost was.

    The gunman had fired numerous rounds into her legs. She was shot four times, but they all struck soft tissue. None of her bones were broken, and no arteries were hit, her son said. But the man was revisiting those he had shot to make sure they were dead and if they weren't, he was shooting them once more.

    Brown's recollections of the horror that she and others in the church experienced, as told to her son, are among the first offered by one of the 20 wounded Sunday in the rampage that killed 26 churchgoers. The son, David Brown, told her story to reporters Monday, including CNN and The Washington Post.

    Snip..

    Up until that point, Farida Brown had only sustained shots to her legs. But as the shooter fired into the woman next to her, Farida Brown prepared to be slain.

    "Then she thought that it was her turn," David Brown told The Washington Post. "She just started praying."

    At that moment, she heard a shot fired from a different man, at the front door
    .


    http://www.sfgate.com/news/article/Inside-the-Texas-church-she-thought-it-was-her-12337562.php
     
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  11. Joe King

    Joe King Gold Member Gold Chaser

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    I've read it, and I know it wasn't you saying that. I was just trying to reconcile the two conflicting stories. I don't doubt either of them, just wondering why two people who were there had such different accounts. If the first time Mr Willeford says he saw the shooter, he was already outside and was only seen to have a handgun, then who was still inside the church shooting the wounded and who shot him? Willeford made no mention of shooting anyone still inside the church. If there was really only one gunman, how can both of their stories be true?
     
  12. smooth

    smooth Gold Member Gold Chaser

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    I've wondered the same thing. I guess it could be possible that the shooter exhausted his ammunition then abandoned the rifle? Using the side arm to get back to his vehicle to either escape or re-arm. Who knows how many rounds were spent inside the church, possibly a couple hundred... It's been noted that he had several rifles in his vehicle.
     
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  13. Joe King

    Joe King Gold Member Gold Chaser

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    Yea, but she said someone shot him while he was still inside the church, and that's what made him stop killing people inside the church.
    ...but our hero says he never saw him with a rifle and first encountered the shooter outside near his vehicle. Is it possible there was more than one shooter and when Willeford engaged Kelley out front, there was still someone else inside who got away out the back door?

    Keep in mind that I'm not accusing either person of lying, I believe both of their accounts and am trying piece them together in a way that makes sense.
     
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  14. Hystckndle

    Hystckndle Daguerreotype Fanatic Site Mgr Site Supporter ++

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    @ Smooth,
    Hey, I have few days off and using them to regroup after Fl storm.
    Anyways, listened to radio all day and they say he rattled off 450 or so rounds in that small church.
    Must be a mess.
     
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  15. Goldhedge

    Goldhedge Moderator Site Mgr Site Supporter

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    Video Unveiled As Horrifying Truth On Texas Massacre Released, Newest Details Shown
    Posted by Georgette Walrath | Nov 9, 2017

    The mass murder of 26 people at the First Baptist Church in Sutherland Springs was a tragic example of the government’s failure to enforce its own laws. In addition to the Air Force’s negligence, much more information has been coming out about the truly evil actions of the atheist shooter. Because the church had a habit of recording each weekly sermon, a seven-minute video of the abominable act has been viewed by officials.

    The tape clearly corroborates witness testimony about 26-year-old Devin Keeley’s wicked act. Fortunately, Kelley was chased by two neighbors and killed by a sharp-shooting law-abiding gun owner, who saw the malevolent man escaping and took him out.

    On Tuesday, investigators explained that they had been trying to unlock the killer’s iPhone. It seems as if liberals are looking for any reason, other than the real one, about Kelley’s motive. They have hinted about an on-going domestic “situation” that involved threatening texts to his mother-in-law.

    However, that lady was not present on the fatal Sunday. Kelley’s actions seem like those of a possessed, methodical fiend. Of course, if the shooting had taken place at a mosque, hate crime investigators would have already labeled it as such. Because it involved a Christian church, it appears that the liberal media, at least, is doing its utmost to pin the evil act on a mental disturbance.

    “Details have emerged about Kelley’s mental health problems” and his criminal past. Why won’t anyone make the connection between atheism and his escape from a psychiatric hospital, his wife-beating, and child-beating incidents? Because to do so would indicate that people who profess “morality” as atheists are full of it. Atheists have no moral compass.

    Regardless of the fact that an NRA member was able to stop the rampage, the Senate judiciary committee will hold a hearing on “firearm accessory” infringement on November 14. Liberals callously use every democrat mass shooting to further their rights-stripping agenda.

    Consider England. The country is in shambles and being overrun by Islamists, but the people have no way to defends themselves. Their guns were collected decades ago.


    According to an unnamed source, the First Baptist Church video shows a calculated murderer, clad in all black (like antifa), who stormed into the building and opened fire. It was apparent that Kelley was intent on killing everyone there—only one of whom had a remote personal connection to him (his wife’s grandmother). None of the other victims were involved in a “domestic situation” with him. The only common link they have is their faith.

    He had over 400 rounds, and only paused to reload as he stood over his wounded victims and executed them with shots to the head. Children, like the pastor’s 14-year-old daughter, were killed by the man enveloped in wickedness.

    Law enforcement agencies did not say whether they would release the footage, but it’s a pretty sure bet that they won’t, especially if anything in it could identify Kelley with an association to antifa or atheists.

    Kelley was a man filled with hate. In addition to the assault case against him, he tried to smuggle firearms onto Holloman Air Force Base in New Mexico. He threatened to kill his superior officers, was a “high risk patient” with suicidal tendencies, and purchased guns illegally.

    He was not granted a carry license in Texas because of an animal cruelty charge in 2014. People who are cruel to animals often become serial killers.

    The fact that officials say that the crime was not religiously motivated should enrage every Christian in this nation. He entered a Church. He killed people because they were there, and because they had been kind to him the previous weekend. The hate and rage that filled his soul was not created by a single situation or even years of mental “problems,” Kelley was an evil person who created difficulties for himself so that he could justify his wickedness.

    On Wednesday, the Texas Department of Public Safety released the names of the dead, including one child yet unborn. Removing morality and God from the nation is returning upon society in the form of people like Kelley who lack every emotion other than hate.
     
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  16. Ensoniq

    Ensoniq Midas Member Midas Member Site Supporter ++

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    If a crazy shot up a moqsue full of mosquitoes you can bet your right arm it'd be declared a religiously motivated crime
     
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  17. andial

    andial Sir Midas Member Site Supporter ++

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    Terrible this church shooting in Vegas.
     
  18. Goldhedge

    Goldhedge Moderator Site Mgr Site Supporter

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  19. Goldhedge

    Goldhedge Moderator Site Mgr Site Supporter

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    AF in CYA Mode

    Air Force Launches Investigation After Failing 3 Times To Stop Killer

    Posted by Israel Cortez | Nov 10, 2017


    [​IMG]
    Air Force Secretary Heather Wilson (left) says the report should be ready next week.

    The Air Force missed three opportunities to prevent Texas church shooter Devin Kelley from purchasing firearms in recent years, according to a report from Reuters.

    The military branch missed two opportunities to stop Kelley from buying guns after he was accused of violence in 2012, according to officials and military documents obtained by the publication. Kelley had been court-martialed in 2012 for assaulting his wife and stepson, including cracking the infant’s skull. Authorities also missed a third chance to put an alert on Kelly when a Pentagon probe of cases did not include him.

    The report comes after the Air Force revealed on Monday it had failed to enter Kelly’s domestic violence conviction in a federal database used for background checks on gun sales.
    Kelly killed 26 people on Sunday when he opened fire on a congregation at a Baptist church in Sutherland Springs, Texas.

    The 2012 conviction likely would have blocked Kelley from purchasing the military-style rifle that he used in the shooting, as well as three other guns he had purchased over the past four years, according to The New York Times.

    “The Air Force has launched a review of how the service handled the criminal records of former Airman Devin P. Kelley following his 2012 domestic violence conviction,” the Air Force said in a statement provided to The Hill on Monday.

    “Federal law prohibited him from buying or possessing firearms after this conviction.”

    Air Force Secretary Heather Wilson said on Thursday the service had spoken to more than 100 people on how the Texas church shooter’s criminal history had been overlooked and said a draft report on the matter would be expected next week.

    H/T: The Hill
     
  20. andial

    andial Sir Midas Member Site Supporter ++

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    Will this draft report be discussed on the Ellen show?
     
  21. the_shootist

    the_shootist The war is here on our doorstep! Midas Member Site Supporter ++

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    The anti's will change from striker gun laws to banning guns all together. You see, they are laser focused on disarming us. They have no other goal in mind!!
     
  22. searcher

    searcher Mother Lode Found Site Supporter ++ Mother Lode

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    Had to edit out pics due to possible copyright issues.

    This Sunday, Some Churchgoers May Choose to Pack Guns With Their Bibles
    Congregations face question of security at services in wake of Texas shooting; ‘a responsibility to protect the flock’

    By
    Ian Lovett and Erin Ailworth
    Nov. 12, 2017 7:00 a.m. ET

    As he does every Sunday, the Rt. Rev. Council Nedd II, an Anglican rector, will put on his collar and robes to offer Mass at his central Pennsylvania church. Now, he is considering wearing something else with his religious vestments: his handgun.

    As a Pennsylvania state constable, Dr. Nedd can bring his gun just about everywhere—to the grocery store, to the park and to synagogues and other houses of worship, where he often acts as security. His church was the one place where he went unarmed.

    “Weapons do not belong in church,” he said. But, as a bishop, he has “a responsibility to protect the flock,” he added.

    One week after a shooting at a Texas church left 26 dead and 20 more wounded, congregations gathering for worship around the country Sunday are once again facing the question of security. Long the last frontier where many gun owners went unarmed, the faithful are now considering whether they should bring firearms to their houses of worship as well.

    Many who live near Sutherland Springs, Texas, where last week’s shooting took place, said they didn’t bring their weapons into their houses of worship.

    Tomie Barker, who attends Christ Lutheran Church of Elm Creek in Seguin, Texas, about 15 miles north of Sutherland Springs, said her husband didn’t have the firearm he is licensed to carry on him last Sunday when their church was locked down following the shooting at the nearby First Baptist Church. But, she said, he plans to have it with him this Sunday.

    “Why would we take a gun to church? Church and school—we feel like we ought to be safe,” she said on Saturday, nearly a week after the shooting. “But he’s not leaving home without it now.”

    Ms. Barker, 60, thinks other worshipers will feel the same, and said she told her pastor that the church should probably make note of who is armed in case another emergency arises.

    “I’ve told everybody, I told my pastor: I’m not going to be a sitting duck or a fish in the barrel,” she said. “We know all about the whack-a-doodles and the copycats.”

    Houses of worship are among the softest of soft targets, with inherent missions and traditions emphasizing peace and welcoming. Churches, synagogues, mosques and Sikh temples have struggled to balance their desire to provide an open sanctuary for the community with security. In recent years, many houses of worship have installed cameras and hired armed guards.

    After the shooting last Sunday, Ken Paxton, the Texas attorney general, said churches needed armed protection.

    Another shooting is “going to happen again, so we need people in churches, either professional security or at least arming some of the parishioners,” he said in an interview on Fox News.

    Prestonwood Baptist Church, a megachurch in Plano, Texas, announced last week that it would be holding a free seminar on church security. Representatives from more than 300 churches, large and small, signed up within three days.

    With roughly 12,000 attendees at its services every Sunday, Prestonwood has armed security guards. Jack Graham, the church’s pastor, said the church had resisted putting in metal detectors so that the church would continue to feel welcoming, and didn’t allow open carry of firearms for the same reason. He suspects some congregants with concealed-carry permits do bring their firearms.

    “Frankly, it brings some comfort,” Dr. Graham said of the armed church members. “If there had been someone with a weapon in that little church, maybe that could have been prevented.”

    But not every house of worship can afford private security. Smaller churches are now considering arming the congregation or clergy.

    Tambria Read, a schoolteacher and chairwoman of the Sutherland Springs Historical Museum, owns a gun and supports people being able to carry them, but had always preferred to keep firearms out of religious spaces.

    “I’m not too crazy about guns in church—somebody could take the gun and do something,” said Ms. Read, 59, who sometimes worshiped at the First Baptist Church but wasn’t there last week. “Maybe somebody in a church needs a gun, someone strategic, but not everybody in a pew.”

    St. Alban’s Anglican Church in Pine Grove Mills, Pa., where Dr. Nedd is rector, has roughly 50 members, and no budget for private security.

    Until several years ago, the church was open 24 hours a day, with no locks on the doors. After a deadly shooting at the Emanuel African Methodist Episcopal Church in Charleston, S.C., last year, the St. Alban’s congregation discussed security measures. When a newcomer showed up, everyone eyed him warily. Dr. Nedd considered bringing his gun, but decided against it.

    Wendy Coulson, a 55-year-old member of St. Alban’s congregation, said she had never brought a gun to church before last year.

    Then, one Sunday after the Charleston shooting, she was spiritually guided to bring her gun, she said. Ms. Coulson has a concealed carry permit, and didn’t tell anyone it was with her, she said. Though she hasn’t brought her gun since, having it that day made her feel better, she said.

    “The reality of the times is that, if I’m in church, I can’t be completely abandoned to my worship, because I have half an ear listening for a strange sound—that’s the unfortunate part of what we’re dealing with today,” said Ms. Coulson, an engineering consultant. “If somebody were to target our church, I definitely would feel more comfortable that somebody else had an opportunity to slow them day,” she added.

    Inez Howe, another parishioner, is from a house with “so many guns.” But her family, too, hasn’t brought them to church. She uses the guns largely for rattlesnakes, she said, adding that her husband, a devoted shooter and collector, doesn’t want to be in a position of using a gun to kill a person.

    Still, Ms. Howe would be more comfortable now if someone—“maybe the bishop”—would be armed in church.

    “I would never have even thought of a gun in church,” Ms. Howe, 74, said. “But if someone would walk in, I’d hope that we would be prepared.”

    Dr. Nedd, the church’s rector, remained torn about whether to arm himself.

    “I don’t feel right carrying it on my person when I’m saying mass,” he said. “I’ll probably spend a bunch of time praying about it, and then make a decision when I walk out the door on Sunday morning.”

    —Tawnell D. Hobbs contributed to this article.

    Write to Ian Lovett at Ian.Lovett@wsj.com and Erin Ailworth at Erin.Ailworth@wsj.com

    https://www.wsj.com/articles/this-s...ose-to-pack-guns-with-their-bibles-1510488001
     
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  23. Joe King

    Joe King Gold Member Gold Chaser

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    Yes, and in great detail too. Just like the Vegas shooting was.
     
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  24. Ensoniq

    Ensoniq Midas Member Midas Member Site Supporter ++

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  25. searcher

    searcher Mother Lode Found Site Supporter ++ Mother Lode

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    'Please know this is not a gun free zone': Florida church warns that its congregation is 'heavily armed' and will handle attacks with 'deadly force' after the Sutherland Springs massacre
    • The River at Tampa Bay, in east Tampa, Florida, warns that the church is armed
    • The non-denominational church has had warning signs on every door for a year
    • Pastor Rodney Howard-Browne reminded his followers about them days after the Sutherland Springs, Texas, massacre, which saw 26 killed at a local church
    • Those who are armed during services include have concealed-carry permits
    • The non-denominational church has 24-hour security at the 83-acre property


    Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5100909/Florida-church-warns-heavily-armed.html#ixzz4yzXFO0ly
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  26. EO 11110

    EO 11110 He Hate Me Mother Lode

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    just an aside on this area of tx --- those small towns/communities in that region are some of the best in texas. lots of salt of the earth farmers/craftsmen. the mom and pop smokehouses and bakeries are incredible

    this area is on my short list of retirement homes
     

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