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Hacking Team broke Bitcoin secrecy by targeting crucial wallet file

Discussion in 'Digital Currencies' started by BarnacleBob, Jul 14, 2015.



  1. BarnacleBob

    BarnacleBob GIM Founding Member & Mod. Founding Member Site Mgr Site Supporter

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  2. Goldhedge

    Goldhedge Modal Operator/Moderator Site Mgr Site Supporter

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    Well, that didn't last long...
     
    917601 and earplugs like this.
  3. Unca Walt

    Unca Walt Midas Member Midas Member

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    Roger that, Goldhedge.

    About a year and a half ago, there was sumbody here (mebbe two sumbodies) that I PLEADED with to sell half their bitcoins when they reached over $1100.

    I said that any encryption could and would be hacked.

    "IMPOSSIBLE! The wallet is sacrosanct." they said.

    Using Hacking Team's solution, it wouldn’t matter if a target had encrypted wallet.dat, nor if he or she was using an online wallet (such as Coinbase.com). The company's embedded keylogger would surely capture the relevant password. And as one leaked company e-mail explained, the Money Module feature automatically exported this data to the "evidence" portion of the Remote Control System software.
     
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  4. Mujahideen

    Mujahideen Black Member Midas Member

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    They pretty much infected the personal computer and stole passwords and the wallet, they didn't hack the block chain from what I understand.

    Seems like nothing new.
     
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  5. BarnacleBob

    BarnacleBob GIM Founding Member & Mod. Founding Member Site Mgr Site Supporter

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    Oops, seems like the crypto electronic cashless society idea just may implode before it even starts, at least until the entire user base is thoroughly secured..... A secure block chain is only half the issue if the user half's not secure in toto....
     
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  6. bemac

    bemac Midas Member Midas Member

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    I'm glad some can read.
     
  7. Ragnarok

    Ragnarok I'd rather be Midas Member

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    If a code can be written, it can also be hacked, it's just a matter of time.

    R.
     
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  8. Unca Walt

    Unca Walt Midas Member Midas Member

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    "If a code can be written, it can also be hacked, it's just a matter of time."

    I can read. And in the past, there are those (you?) who swore the wallet was unbreakable** <-- We'll come back to that... This was the ultimate in safety. This was in response to my cold, bold statement that: if bitcoins are blips in a computer (and they most ricky-tick are), then somebody -- and soon -- will figure out a way to access those blips.

    Now we continue. OK. My first posit has been proven. Your first assertion has been refuted. But regarding the ** above... would you really stand there flatfooted and (given that bitcoins succeeds to your dreams) flatly state that an algorithm/code/yada CANNOT BE BROKEN??

    If you answer in the affirmative, think about it: So did the Third Reich.


    Just thought of another way of describing what happened: The ENCRYPTION was broken.

    Here is how it went

    The ENCRYPTION consisted of

    1. The loser's computer (he even had a virus program I bet) The loser's computer gave up ALL his passwords for EVERYTHING.

    2. The loser's passwords. The loser's passwords gave up the sooper sekrit unbreakable code which now was broken by the loudmouthed password file.

    3. The sooper sekrit ubreakable code follows orders and opens the wallet.

    4. The wallet is the very last, helpless, virginal (once) part of the

    5. ENCRYPTION THAT WAS BROKEN. HELP YOURSELF TO ALL THEM BITCOINS.


    Q.E.D.
     
  9. smartypants

    smartypants Seeker

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    No encryption broken, just password stolen. You encrypt your wallet file ofc.
     
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  10. Unca Walt

    Unca Walt Midas Member Midas Member

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    (*sigh*)

    Wayta miss the point, smartypants.

    PAY ATTENTION THIS TIME:

    I defined the "encryption" as the whole thing:

    1. bitcoins (encrypted) in a computer. <-- Still with me? Can you follow that bitcoins ARE bits in a computer? OK.

    2. the bitcoins are vulnerable (like I said) to theft.

    3. the bitcoins were, yes, stolen. Oh, my. Even though you are standing there flatfooted and arguing semantics while the bitcoins now belong to someone else (the bitcoin thief).

    You can play technical word-games (dangerous to do) with me, but the bottom line remains: All the fargin encryption extant HAS BEEN DEMONSTRATED TO BE INADEQUATE.

    Can you follow: If there are ways (and there are) for passwords to be stolen, then the (*AHEM*) "encryption" can be broken in a heartbeat 100% of the time.

    You sound like General Turgidson in the War Room: "We shouldn't condemn a whole program for just a little glitch."


    And I dare you to answer this truthfully and cut the prevaricating bullshit. Do you or do you not agree:

    "If a code can be written, it can also be hacked, it's just a matter of time."

    HINT: Third Reich.

    I DARE you to say "no".

    This, BTW, DIRECTLY addresses your erroneous belief (so far) that the encryption is unbreakable. You know it is breakable. I know it is breakable. Every sumbitch reading this knows that your sacred encryption IS breakable.

    Right?

    Meanwhile, thieves can -- and have -- used a simple shortcut which goes right around your sacred code... and emptied the till.

    Right?
     
  11. Brent H

    Brent H Silver Miner Seeker

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    The whole argument about whether wallets can be hacked is irrelevant, unless "Bitcoins" can be proven to exist.

    Can you see a bitcoin? No.
    Can you feel a bitcoin? No.
    Can you hear a bitcoin? No.
    How much does a bitcoin weigh? _____

    So, people claim to own things that they can neither see, feel, hear, or weigh. How exactly does that work?
     
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  12. Gun Ban Extremist

    Gun Ban Extremist Seeker Seeker

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    They cannot be proven to exist, because they do not exist. You cannot point to anything in a wallet, blockchain or anywhere else and claim that this is a bitcoin. Bitcoins are not even represented as bits or digits -- they simply do not exist in reality, only abstractly.

    What does exist is the blockchain, namely a ledger that contains all transactions among bitcoin holders, enabling determination of who has how much.
     
  13. bemac

    bemac Midas Member Midas Member

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    Are you suggesting something which only abstractly exists cannot have value?
     
  14. Unca Walt

    Unca Walt Midas Member Midas Member

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    What he is "suggesting" is what he is saying:

    "What does exist is the blockchain, namely a ledger that contains all transactions among bitcoin holders, enabling determination of who has how much."

    Bemac: Whether men value the theoretical dungsyi <-- Mandarin for "thing" or not is absolutely not what we are discussing at all.

    In fact, you make a point in favor of the "IT WILL GET STOLEN" already proven point. Yes, there are those who will/have put value on bitcoin.

    And yes, as YOU are suggesting, since some see bitcoins as value, they WILL/HAVE BEEN stolen. Useless encryption or not.

    There It Is.
     
  15. Unca Walt

    Unca Walt Midas Member Midas Member

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    Inspector Clueseau's "bimp" for smartypants:


     
  16. smartypants

    smartypants Seeker

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    If you claim that you have proven that P = NP please post it.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/P_versus_NP_problem

    By the way you can engrave your private key in gold with diamonds and dig it down. You do not need to store your private key on a computer drive.
     
  17. smartypants

    smartypants Seeker

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  18. smartypants

    smartypants Seeker

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    This is how Bitcoins are born.
    https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Coinbase

    Yes, out of thin air, but at a constant predictable rate.

    -s-
     
  19. Gun Ban Extremist

    Gun Ban Extremist Seeker Seeker

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    Exactly the opposite, at least in the eyes of humans.
     
  20. Unca Walt

    Unca Walt Midas Member Midas Member

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    Light bends around some people because of their density.
     
  21. Bigjon

    Bigjon Silver Member Silver Miner Site Supporter ++

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    You are invisible.
     
  22. bemac

    bemac Midas Member Midas Member

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    And some old people are just scared of technology. ;)

    But seriously, I have never owned a bitcoin or any other digital currency, but if you can't see the future potential in it, you're not thinking it all through.
     
  23. Usury

    Usury Gold Chaser Platinum Bling

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    BUT, BUT, BUT......IT CAN'T BE HACKED!!!!!
     
  24. Usury

    Usury Gold Chaser Platinum Bling

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    Yep....this has been my contention from day one. If all the increase in hacking at banks, large businesses, federal government, etc. hasn't opened someone's eyes to this fact, then they want to be blind.
     
  25. Mr.Jens

    Mr.Jens Seeker Seeker

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    Can I use it without the internet? Can I use it without electricity and without batteries? If not, I'm not interested.
     
  26. Mujahideen

    Mujahideen Black Member Midas Member

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    bemac likes this.
  27. bemac

    bemac Midas Member Midas Member

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    And that's fine. I have even better reasons to not buy/own bitcoin. That said, another person could argue you can't use gold/silver to purchase something over the internet, and then claim to not be interested if that's the case.
     
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  28. Strawboss

    Strawboss Intergalactic Silver Guru Gold Chaser

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    Digital currency is the future we are headed into - I think we can all agree on that point. As Unca Walt has demonstrably proven - the current means of protecting the "accounts" is not as secure as it needs to be in order to facilitate global acceptance/trust...

    When I polish off my crystal ball and gaze deeply into it - what I envision is where biometrics are included in the security somehow (fingerprints, retinal eye scan, perhaps an implanted RFID)...basically - mark of the beast stuff...

    I dont think its possible to have an entirely secure system - there will always be theft. The trick is to keep it contained so that its a relatively minor issue in the grand scheme of things.
     

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