1. Same story, different day...........year ie more of the same fiat floods the world
    Dismiss Notice
  2. There are no markets
    Dismiss Notice
  3. Week of 6/24/2017 Closing prices & Chg Over Last Wk---- Gold $1256.40 Silver $16.64 Oil $43.01 USD $96.94
  4. "Spreading the ideas of freedom loving people on matters regarding high finance, politics, constructionist Constitution, and mental masturbation of all types"
    Dismiss Notice

Home Stilling

Discussion in 'Survival (Preps & Homestead)' started by AceNZ, Jul 23, 2016.



  1. AceNZ

    AceNZ Silver Member Silver Miner

    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2010
    Messages:
    825
    Likes Received:
    517
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    American in New Zealand
  2. mtnman

    mtnman Gold Member Gold Chaser Site Supporter ++

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2010
    Messages:
    3,628
    Likes Received:
    5,407
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired Shipyard Machinist
    Location:
    East Tennessee
    How are the laws in NZ? Over here it's a felony to distill at home with out a licence.
     
    Flight2gold likes this.
  3. michael59

    michael59 heads up-butts down Site Supporter ++ Platinum Bling

    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2014
    Messages:
    7,049
    Likes Received:
    3,486
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    20 years logging
    Location:
    on the low side of corporate Oregon
    Law? It is only the revenue man that cares.

    Interesting fact: Prohibition was responsible for so many deaths due to methanol poisoning. And, because of these deaths the coroner of new york city had to do forensics. Yeah, that is where it all started.

    Anywhoo, nice still. I have been thinking of making a positive feed, steam fed Christmas tree still.
     
    TAEZZAR likes this.
  4. AceNZ

    AceNZ Silver Member Silver Miner

    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2010
    Messages:
    825
    Likes Received:
    517
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    American in New Zealand
    Distilling for home use is legal in NZ. No license needed. No taxes payable. You just can't sell it or give it away. If you do want to sell it, there's an excise tax of US $35 per quart of 100% (NZ $51 per L).

    FWIW, growing your own tobacco is also legal (illegal in the US).
     
  5. AceNZ

    AceNZ Silver Member Silver Miner

    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2010
    Messages:
    825
    Likes Received:
    517
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    American in New Zealand
    I realize it's illegal in the US. Even so, I know many, many people there who make it. It's apparently pretty easy in some places to get a license to distill alcohol for "automotive use only."

    Another interesting fact: with just a little distilling knowledge, it's easy to eliminate methanol. I'm convinced the whole people-died-by-methanol-poisoning thing is a giant fear-mongering scam. Not that it didn't happen, just that when it did, the people responsible were idiots.
     
    TAEZZAR and michael59 like this.
  6. michael59

    michael59 heads up-butts down Site Supporter ++ Platinum Bling

    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2014
    Messages:
    7,049
    Likes Received:
    3,486
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    20 years logging
    Location:
    on the low side of corporate Oregon
    No it actually happened these dead people. Had nothing to do with those that "knew" how to do it, had to do with those who wanted to profit and did not care. Bathtub jin. Kind of like the same poison that works its way through the drug trade today.

    Look, we all know it is not a unconserved thing to brew, the thing back then was POS-its did it because they could. And, it just wasn't one guy like say the Alvin from chick-a-go.....No it was a bunch of people.... And they talk about the zombie craze drug going around now, shit bath salts fall into this cata-gory.

    Thing is the uninformed do try and sometimes their end result is body's found just laying there and then sometimes they get it right.....BUT, the learning curve is steep.
     
  7. nickndfl

    nickndfl Midas Member Midas Member Site Supporter ++

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2011
    Messages:
    12,001
    Likes Received:
    9,921
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Florida
    How are you gonna move that shine' boy?

     
  8. mtnman

    mtnman Gold Member Gold Chaser Site Supporter ++

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2010
    Messages:
    3,628
    Likes Received:
    5,407
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired Shipyard Machinist
    Location:
    East Tennessee
    Nothing illegal about growing Tobacco, ya just can't sell it without paying the taxes. Now growing that other smoke, they kinda frown on that...
     
    oldgaranddad likes this.
  9. mtnman

    mtnman Gold Member Gold Chaser Site Supporter ++

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2010
    Messages:
    3,628
    Likes Received:
    5,407
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired Shipyard Machinist
    Location:
    East Tennessee
    Here's my still collection. The big one on the left is a 35 gallon Kentucky Pot Still. It's complete, Pot, thump and condenser and It was making liquor a year ago. The center one, the dark pointy one is a 2 gallon stove top still made in the 1920's here in Tennessee and the on on the far right is a 5 gallon stove top still. made in the 1950's here in Tennessee. It wasn't uncommon for a family to keep a still to run on the stove, for medicinal use...

    P1060632.JPG
     
    southfork and Irons like this.
  10. latemetal

    latemetal Platinum Bling Platinum Bling

    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2010
    Messages:
    4,939
    Likes Received:
    2,738
    Trophy Points:
    113
  11. nickndfl

    nickndfl Midas Member Midas Member Site Supporter ++

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2011
    Messages:
    12,001
    Likes Received:
    9,921
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Florida
  12. AceNZ

    AceNZ Silver Member Silver Miner

    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2010
    Messages:
    825
    Likes Received:
    517
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    American in New Zealand
    I'm not saying it didn't. Blindness from methanol was more common than death, but both happened.

    Yeah, like I said: idiots.

    Steep learning curve to get something that tastes great. Easy as spit to get something safe.
     
    historyrepete likes this.
  13. AceNZ

    AceNZ Silver Member Silver Miner

    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2010
    Messages:
    825
    Likes Received:
    517
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    American in New Zealand
    Ah, OK. I was told otherwise by a friend in the US. Maybe the law varies by state?
     
  14. AceNZ

    AceNZ Silver Member Silver Miner

    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2010
    Messages:
    825
    Likes Received:
    517
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    American in New Zealand
    Wow! Those are awesome. Love the old-style copper work.
     
  15. brosil

    brosil Gold Member Gold Chaser Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2010
    Messages:
    2,143
    Likes Received:
    1,765
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Oak Harbor, Ohio
    First off, it's legal to grow a tenth of an acre of tobacco for your own use. Second, the .gov intentionally poisoned booze to try and get folks to stop drinking. Estimated deaths were 50k. No one was prosecuted.
     
  16. Unca Walt

    Unca Walt Midas Member Midas Member

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2011
    Messages:
    6,967
    Likes Received:
    7,580
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    South Floriduh
    Jeepers. Do I see soldered seams???
     
    Goldhedge and michael59 like this.
  17. TAEZZAR

    TAEZZAR LADY JUSTICE ISNT BLIND, SHES JUST AFRAID TO WATCH Midas Member Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2010
    Messages:
    11,164
    Likes Received:
    17,592
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    ORYGUN
    My granddad, on mom's side, had a still in his basement in Los Angeles & the local priest would visit him regularly until someone snitched & the feds busted in & destroyed his "blessed" still.
    I make my own whyne, I think brandy would be interesting.
     
    searcher likes this.
  18. mtnman

    mtnman Gold Member Gold Chaser Site Supporter ++

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2010
    Messages:
    3,628
    Likes Received:
    5,407
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired Shipyard Machinist
    Location:
    East Tennessee
    Yep, and it's most defiantly lead solder. That still was originally built in the 1920's, so said the man who I bought it from. Any brain damage ya might get from the lead will be negated by the damage from the alcohol!
     
    Unca Walt likes this.
  19. AceNZ

    AceNZ Silver Member Silver Miner

    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2010
    Messages:
    825
    Likes Received:
    517
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    American in New Zealand
    Even where it's illegal today, distilling is a good thing to know how to do, IMO -- like cooking or hunting. The only potentially better currency than gold is booze. Plus, laws can and do change. There's a big movement in the US to legalize home distilling.

    If anyone has questions on the theory side of things, I'll answer them if I can.
     
  20. Flight2gold

    Flight2gold Silver Member Silver Miner Site Supporter ++

    Joined:
    May 12, 2010
    Messages:
    1,486
    Likes Received:
    1,842
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    pilot
    Location:
    Florida
    AceNZ,
    Asking here.

    Didn't the blindness cases occur from people using radiator fluid to cool the output ?

    I've got a small 30 liter still I've used for years to make a variety of things.
    My water connections to the pot still run down a copper tube into an igloo cooler full of ice.
    I've never been able to figure out a better way.
    It's a fun hobby but as others have said illegal in the US.
    You can make 10,000 gallons a year legally if you apply with the BATF.
    Of course, you have to add ingredients to make this officially ethanol.
    Undrinkable.

    So officially, I've never made booze. Only distilled water and oils.
    I'll dust off my little still and upload a picture.
    I just realized I've got a large package of different types of yeast still in my freezer.
     
    Last edited: Jul 25, 2016
  21. AceNZ

    AceNZ Silver Member Silver Miner

    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2010
    Messages:
    825
    Likes Received:
    517
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    American in New Zealand
    Haven't heard about that, but I can't imagine anyone using radiator antifreeze (ethylene glycol) to cool a condenser, since water alone works perfectly fine.

    However, I have heard of people trying to drink ethylene glycol, and that will definitely mess you up.

    What most people do is to use a condenser with a water jacket, along with a large barrel or similar container filled with cold water, and a small recirculating pump to move the water from the container through the condenser. With a large enough container, it will take a long time for the water to heat up to the point where it stops being useful. You can also add more cold water along the way. I use a bathtub in that way. The water doesn't have to be ice cold, although the colder it is, the better the condenser will work.

    It can work with a smaller container like an igloo cooler, but you might need to steadily replace warm water with cold when it gets too hot.

    Yes. My favorite wash uses white sugar and tomato paste. The fermentation step is perfectly legal in the US, of course -- kinda like beer, but much easier. (you can get to about 14% alcohol that way).

    Getting something drinkable out of a pot still alone is a bit of an art. The best way involves making frequent cuts (switching to a new capture container) to separate the foreshots, head, heart and tail, plus going pretty slowly. It's best suited for certain end products, such as whiskey and certain rums. Neutral spirits (vodka) require a distillation column (tower).

    I use my pot still for "stripping" runs, which reduces the total volume way down, and eliminates all of the poisons and most of the bad tasting components. I follow that with one or more runs through the tower for neutral. Gin pushes good neutral through a basket of botanicals, in a pot still-like setup.
     
  22. TAEZZAR

    TAEZZAR LADY JUSTICE ISNT BLIND, SHES JUST AFRAID TO WATCH Midas Member Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2010
    Messages:
    11,164
    Likes Received:
    17,592
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    ORYGUN
    Law? It is only the revenue man that cares.

    EVERYTHING I LIKE IS ETHER
    ILLEGAL, IMMORAL OR FATTENING !!! :belly laugh:
     
    michael59 likes this.
  23. Flight2gold

    Flight2gold Silver Member Silver Miner Site Supporter ++

    Joined:
    May 12, 2010
    Messages:
    1,486
    Likes Received:
    1,842
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    pilot
    Location:
    Florida
    I use a 25 foot piece of 1/2 inch copper coil. Drop it in the igloo with water filled frozen bottles of whatever. Add some ice occasionally.
    I think the ethyl glycol would leak through the inputs in the column and get added accidently into the final product. I'm sure some of the deaths were of the malicious type also. In the 1930's "jake walking" was a term individuals that purchased even cheaper illegal booze with up 70% alcohol content. Of course, when they added an industrial chemical called tri-ortho-cresyl phosphate to help water down the jake paralysis occurred.
    Sounds great. I remember starting with sugar shine. White sugar, yeast and water then stripped it out. I think 92%. Used the reflux still attachment though not a pot still.

    Great info. No expert here.
     
    Last edited: Jul 25, 2016
  24. Professur

    Professur Midas Member Midas Member Site Supporter ++

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2010
    Messages:
    5,060
    Likes Received:
    5,012
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I keep telling people .. you're wasting your time with stills. Brew in winter. Leave it outside and when the temp drops the water freezes solid, and you're left with your alcohol. No distilling required.

    Also ... why are none of you running solar stills?
     
  25. michael59

    michael59 heads up-butts down Site Supporter ++ Platinum Bling

    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2014
    Messages:
    7,049
    Likes Received:
    3,486
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    20 years logging
    Location:
    on the low side of corporate Oregon
    Was thinking of distilling my cider this year but with a specific gravity of 151 it is already pushing 20 something percent which is fine for me. It is actually one third by volume or so. Yeah I have a friend who aants to Jack some barley and I was thinking reduced....or pulling a vacuum on it bit also have been thinking of running steam through the pot and letting the vapor condense on or through a tree.

    Maybe I should stick to the little flame as a heat source....I mean I could blow shit sky high generating the steam.
     
    Professur likes this.
  26. Flight2gold

    Flight2gold Silver Member Silver Miner Site Supporter ++

    Joined:
    May 12, 2010
    Messages:
    1,486
    Likes Received:
    1,842
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    pilot
    Location:
    Florida
    Solar? Good idea.
    Temp in Florida? IDK
     
  27. AceNZ

    AceNZ Silver Member Silver Miner

    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2010
    Messages:
    825
    Likes Received:
    517
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    American in New Zealand
    Would be a lot less expensive to use plastic tubing from the condenser to the water, but copper would certainly work.

    The tomato paste provides nutrients for the yeast, so you get faster, more complete fermentation and less bad-tasting crap.

    I used to run my ferments through the reflux tower first. However, I found the taste that way was pretty crappy, even going very slow. I get better results now by doing a stripping run using the pot still setup first, followed by a run in the tower, which produces 95% azeotrope (190 proof). Ultimate purity and taste takes a second run through the tower, though, followed by carbon filtration.

    If only it was so easy! Sadly, freezing doesn't separate alcohol from water, as the booze in my freezer shows.

    I use a 2400W heating element in my boiler. Even then, it takes an hour or more to heat to the boiling point. After that, a full run in a reflux tower can take 8 hours. Getting that much heat to the boiler for that long using solar would be a huge pain in the ass.

    Nice! We're making cider now, too. I'm planning to try making apple brandy, which is distilled cider. Should be fun.

    There are reasons for distilling over-and-above just increasing alcohol concentration. The methanol mentioned earlier, for example, is generated by the yeast, along with a bunch of other foul-tasting junk. The distillation process only helps remove it, not make it. Removing the crap from the ferment can improve flavor hugely, while also minimizing hangovers.

    There are some cool "alternative" stills out there. Most are horribly inefficient, but playing around with them can be fun.

    To purify, you don't need to run steam through the pot. Just heat it up, and help the vapor condense somewhere. When done in a controlled, efficient way, that's exactly what a still does.

    You definitely don't want to mix open flames and stills -- alcohol vapor is flammable. Even worse, when pure it tends to burn with a flame that's nearly invisible; very dangerous.
     
  28. mtnman

    mtnman Gold Member Gold Chaser Site Supporter ++

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2010
    Messages:
    3,628
    Likes Received:
    5,407
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired Shipyard Machinist
    Location:
    East Tennessee
    Aurumag likes this.
  29. AceNZ

    AceNZ Silver Member Silver Miner

    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2010
    Messages:
    825
    Likes Received:
    517
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    American in New Zealand
    Yeah, open flame can work if you're very well-ventilated (outdoors) -- it is dangerous, though. But, hey, people do all kinds of crazy shit.

    Have you seen this show?
    http://www.discovery.com/tv-shows/moonshiners/videos/4am-fire/

    On a related note, one of the things regulators like to complain about with the commercial sale of high-proof alcohol like Everclear is that it's flammable. Well, that and how drinking a quart of it can kill you. Kinda seems like a cure for stupid to me, but then what do I know.
     
  30. Zed

    Zed Size doesn't count! Midas Member

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2010
    Messages:
    11,493
    Likes Received:
    9,530
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Nuclear Technician
    Location:
    Springfield
  31. Zed

    Zed Size doesn't count! Midas Member

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2010
    Messages:
    11,493
    Likes Received:
    9,530
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Nuclear Technician
    Location:
    Springfield
     
  32. michael59

    michael59 heads up-butts down Site Supporter ++ Platinum Bling

    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2014
    Messages:
    7,049
    Likes Received:
    3,486
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    20 years logging
    Location:
    on the low side of corporate Oregon
    Yep I've injured my dendrites a time or two.

    On the Apple cider: do not strain, do not let it kick open aired. Seems if you strain and put a bubbler on it you get Apple wine, nasty. For a crisp flavor: what ever is pressed with the liquid goes into the barrel. If heat conditions are very warm cap barrel and burp daily to control yeast activity and thereby taste. If you chose not to Jack with a cold activated yeast and would rather use natural yeast in Apple's your brew will come out tasting like sour apples....very refreshing. And, yes I did 25 to 30 gallons with no yeast last year....Yep, everything mechanical that could go wrong did but weather conditions were cool to very cold and kept open barrel from kicking too hard. By the time I got back to barrel it was 20%. Transferred to barrel that could be capped and finished burping by letting out coh2 once a day. Never did hit that stuff with yeast, sept what was left over in barrel.
     
  33. AceNZ

    AceNZ Silver Member Silver Miner

    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2010
    Messages:
    825
    Likes Received:
    517
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    American in New Zealand
    That sour / green apple taste is acetaldehyde. It's terrible in distilled spirits, but can be OK in small amounts in fermented products. Budweiser is famous for purposely leaving a little acetaldehyde in their beer.

    BTW, if you leave cider exposed to air for a few months (like with a cheesecloth over the top of the container), it usually turns to vinegar -- another useful SHTF item. (you can speed it up by adding a Mother of Vinegar starter).

    Fresh apples normally have a little yeast on the skin, so they often start fermenting on their own. However, if you want a consistent product, most people kill the natural yeast with something like Campden tablets, and then add a specific yeast that's known to work well for cider.
     
  34. mtnman

    mtnman Gold Member Gold Chaser Site Supporter ++

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2010
    Messages:
    3,628
    Likes Received:
    5,407
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired Shipyard Machinist
    Location:
    East Tennessee
    AceNZ likes this.
  35. michael59

    michael59 heads up-butts down Site Supporter ++ Platinum Bling

    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2014
    Messages:
    7,049
    Likes Received:
    3,486
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    20 years logging
    Location:
    on the low side of corporate Oregon
    I don't know there New Zealand ace, every one comes back for more cider.

    Some times it is the comedy of errors that makes the brew. I first did it like all the "books" related how it was supposed to be done and even I was not happy with the product. In fact I remember kicking over a 50gallon juice barrel of cider because it went acetic. All I know is that the stuff that went sour why that cider was not sour to begin with, in fact it was the last batch I ran due to every thing going to hell in a hand basket.

    Oh well gearing up for this season if I live that long.
     
  36. michael59

    michael59 heads up-butts down Site Supporter ++ Platinum Bling

    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2014
    Messages:
    7,049
    Likes Received:
    3,486
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    20 years logging
    Location:
    on the low side of corporate Oregon
    Oh yeah word to the unknowing.....when you cap off let the cider sit for a few months. It will clear and taste better, another error which proved useful.
     
  37. wallew

    wallew Gold Member Gold Chaser

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2010
    Messages:
    1,349
    Likes Received:
    1,289
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Retired - no job, no money
    Location:
    Texas, USA, North America, Planet Earth

Share This Page