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Honest question; why is nationalism a bad thing?

Discussion in 'Topical Discussions (In Depth)' started by Thecrensh, Jul 7, 2017.



  1. Thecrensh

    Thecrensh Gold Member Gold Chaser

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    Maybe it's my rough and incomplete definition of "nationalism" that is where I'm going wrong. I view it as having a love for one's country, putting one's nation above other nations in the grand scheme of things, looking out for the interests of your fellow citizens first BEFORE looking out for the citizens of other nations.

    What is so wrong with that, and why is that now associated as something akin to being a Nazi by progressives?

    Per Webster, Nationalism is:

    Definition of nationalism

    1
    : loyalty and devotion to a nation; especially : a sense of national consciousness (see consciousness 1c) exalting one nation above all others and placing primary emphasis on promotion of its culture and interests as opposed to those of other nations or supranational groups Intense nationalism was one of the causes of the war.

    2
    : a nationalist movement or government opposing nationalisms


    [www.merriam-webster.com]
     
  2. Mujahideen

    Mujahideen Black Member Midas Member

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    Nationalism can often be confused with governmentism. It can lead to unnecessary war and fascism.
     
  3. michael59

    michael59 heads up-butts down Site Supporter ++ Platinum Bling

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    Me? I am more in tune with the people of the STATE in which I am alive in than with those who are apart. And, I don't even like the ones I rub elbows with.

    crochety? idk...can help you along because you are like me but dammit....I just draw the line when it becomes "you are this."
     
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  4. Thecrensh

    Thecrensh Gold Member Gold Chaser

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    I get that, but per the definition it is "loyalty and devotion to a nation;"
     
  5. Mujahideen

    Mujahideen Black Member Midas Member

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    "Nation" is where it's confusing.

    Loyalty to the people is one thing, loyalty to the government is another. Imo.

    Tptb in government will use nationalism to manipulate the people into being sheep.

    When 9/11 happened, many people's were united in a nationalistic feeling, emergency responders were viewed as heros and people felt together on the same team... and then came the wars on people who had nothing to do with it and the ensuing police state.

    To what MICHAEL59 said, I think "nationalism" is only good at the local or maybe the state level.
     
    Last edited: Jul 7, 2017
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  6. Bottom Feeder

    Bottom Feeder Hypophthalmichthys molitrix Gold Chaser Site Supporter

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    Nationalism and fascism are teeth in the same comb. The question lies in how far apart they are in their time frames. Nationalism would have to predate fascism in order for the people to give their all to the state. So, it would seem to the simple thinker, that the obvious way to defeat fascism is to quell nationalism before it starts.

    And, of course, one simple way to turn people against something is to begin referring to it in unsavory terms. So, for reasons unbeknown to me, the group-think directors have decided that it’s in their best interest to eliminate nationalism. And the media is pressing people to say it’s a bad thing. It seems like that is the way TPTB run everything. Tearing down our war monuments; letting queers use whichever bathroom they please; male, female and other on driver licenses; overrun with mohammadians, and comedians beheading presidents. We can get pissed off over things other than taxes ya know.

    To me it looks like things are swirling around the drain and there’s nothing you can really do about it. Ya might as well set back with your popcorn and watch the world burn.

    Popcorn Time.jpg

    BF
     
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  7. Bigjon

    Bigjon Silver Member Silver Miner Site Supporter ++

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    The founders of this Federation joined 13 nation states into one federal area. Federal is synonymous with contract.
     
  8. Buck

    Buck Fabian Society Gold Chaser

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    Muj made a great point:

    "Loyalty to the people is one thing, loyalty to the government is another. Imo."

    In the end, in all civilizations, it ends up where one group is rich while all the others are not
    regardless of the type of society

    They have all ended in ruins

    The US was supposedly founded to break this link and this country isn't even 250 yet

    At this moment, I'd bet against it making it to 2026 intact
     
  9. brosil

    brosil Gold Member Gold Chaser Site Supporter

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    The original assault on nationalism was by globalists purportedly to end war. If we're all one big happy family, we'll all get along. Kumbyah! It also makes it a tad easier to control everything and one.
    Nationalism and fascism do Not go together. They may occur at the same time but are not linked.
    Let's go with the 1930s definition of fascism, the close co-operation of business and government. You know, like GM and Google and the Federal Reserve. It's not " The Government won't give me x or tries to stop me from doing y." In my reading, the closest I've found to a right wing government going fascist is Spain's Falangists and I'm not sure about whether they can be classed as right wing. Generally speaking, fascist governments are overwhelmingly left wing. Let's keep that in mind when throwing those words around.
     
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  10. TomD

    TomD It blowed up, y'all Platinum Bling

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    1937_mercury_dime_reverse.jpg
    Before Benito Mussolini originated fascism, he was a high ranking member of the Italian Socialist Party. Fascism was formed in a schism with socialism and is an offshoot, a variation of socialism not a negation. Fascism is named from and symbolized by the Roman fasces, a bundle of rods tied together to represent the people united. The ax embedded in the faces represents the power of life and death. You've seen the image many time before, it was on the back of the US dime for decades.
     
  11. gringott

    gringott Killed then Resurrected Midas Member Site Supporter

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    It is pretty simple really [Why nationalism is a bad thing].

    You can't have a global government by appointed elite while having nationalism at the same time.

    The nation states must be rendered powerless first.

    The most they are going to let the people support is the sports teams.

    Everything else will be by dictate.
     
  12. searcher

    searcher Mother Lode Found Site Supporter ++ Mother Lode

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    You hit the nail on the head with this............:beer:
     
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  13. Ensoniq

    Ensoniq Midas Member Midas Member Site Supporter ++

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    Local representation is more accountable to the voter

    Federal government's aren't very accountable

    A global government would be totally unaccountable

    If the globalist can achieve one world order (whole world government). The citizen will have no say and the globalist's hold on power would be absolute

    Which is why elites are trying to drag us there
     
  14. Howdy

    Howdy Silver Member Silver Miner

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    Nationalism is bad because internationalism is better for the New World Order.
     
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  15. Mujahideen

    Mujahideen Black Member Midas Member

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    Hmm... I think nationalism for the smaller nations can help prevent globalism, but nationalism from the super powers can bring war about... and war can lead to globalization.

    The League of Nations and UN both came after world wars...
     
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  16. Cigarlover

    Cigarlover Gold Member Gold Chaser

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    Aren't borders just imaginary lines? If we were truly free wouldn't everyone just be a citizen of the world? Just a human being wandering around the face of the earth.
    Why do we need a Government? Any government. Everyone wants to travel safely and freely. No reason there cant just be a tax placed on airfare or busfare to support a safer flying or traveling experience. Do we need a Government to implement that? If so why? If something goes wrong are they held accountable?
    The only reason I can see for nationalism is that its easier to put a military power together to conquer lands for the corporations who can buy the governments AKA the military power and grow profits as much as possible. Without nationalism it would be very difficult to put an army together to conquer the world, although it has been done in the past.

    Without a government citizen could hold corporations accountable and put an end to the pollution immediately or shut them down.. In fact without a Government there would be no corporations and the owners of the companies would be held accountable.
     
  17. hammerhead

    hammerhead Not just a screen name Gold Chaser

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    Why the heck do we have doors on houses? Some even come with locks for christsakes.
     
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  18. Bigjon

    Bigjon Silver Member Silver Miner Site Supporter ++

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    Please tell me who among these elites are not Jewish.

    My point is the driving force for world government is the Jews, with them in charge.
     
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2017
  19. Howdy

    Howdy Silver Member Silver Miner

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    One World = no accountability for the ruling class. It's exactly what they want. Abolish borders and empower them.
     
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  20. Cigarlover

    Cigarlover Gold Member Gold Chaser

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    No government= no ruling class.
    Of course no government would never work. Those who dont produce would die pretty quickly and 1/2 the population is gone as soon as the government stops stealing from those who produce to give to those who dont.
    I guess it is a stupid idea. Without government who would buy all those weapons? All those jobs lost.. We need enemies to keep the mic going and employ Muricans.
     
  21. Mujahideen

    Mujahideen Black Member Midas Member

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    What government would enforce the rule of having no government?
     
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  22. anywoundedduck

    anywoundedduck Gold Member Gold Chaser

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    I pledge allegiance to the Flag of the United States of America, and to the Republic for which it stands, one Nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all
    And that's all I have say on this subject.
     
  23. Ensoniq

    Ensoniq Midas Member Midas Member Site Supporter ++

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    I don't think Obama, Hellary, Merkel et al are Jewish
     
  24. hammerhead

    hammerhead Not just a screen name Gold Chaser

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    I'll take 'What are puppets' for 500, Alex.
     
  25. Ensoniq

    Ensoniq Midas Member Midas Member Site Supporter ++

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    image.jpeg
     
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  26. Joe King

    Joe King Gold Member Gold Chaser

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    It's not a stupid idea, but it would still not be as you described. Ie: Every man on the land as his own King.
    The reason it won't is because without a gov proper, people will band together into groups, thereby recreating small local governments. Ie: a form of tribalism would take over. Most people want an authority figure in their lives to at least some degree and that lends itself to those seeking power over the group. Few would actually want to go-it-alone due to the lack of security. On your own, at any point others could gang up on you and take your stuff.
     
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  27. Howdy

    Howdy Silver Member Silver Miner

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    In reality, the real enemies are NOT countries like Iran and North Korea, they are our own "elected" officials, the Military Industrial Complex, the intelligence agencies, the media and the globalist bankers who run them. That understood, The enemy is international. If you internationalize everything, you're playing right into their hands.
     
  28. Howdy

    Howdy Silver Member Silver Miner

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    A one world government would say "We have just conquered the world and we hereby surrender"...

    ..
    .
    not.
     
  29. 917601

    917601 Mother Lode Found Mother Lode

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    Nationalism in the case of the US of A is a good thing, we were founded on Christian values. Advertising and promoting a country that was created by God fearing, believing leaders so long ago gives all the glory to God. Give thanks.
     
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  30. arminius

    arminius Gold Member Gold Chaser Site Supporter ++

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    So nationalism is OK as long as you are the correct religion?
     
  31. Mujahideen

    Mujahideen Black Member Midas Member

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    This is not nationalism.

    Nationalism is about being American; it's not about being a of particular religion.... unless you want to imply people who are not Christians are not really Americans.
     
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  32. brosil

    brosil Gold Member Gold Chaser Site Supporter

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    No, nationalism comes from tribalism. The tribe was your extended family, then your nation became your extended family.. I suppose that if we were being exterminated by aliens (outer space kind) or killer robots , we might pull together and make humanity a family but nothing else will do it.
     
  33. Ensoniq

    Ensoniq Midas Member Midas Member Site Supporter ++

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    Nationalism is ok if it's your nation
     
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  34. Son of Gloin

    Son of Gloin Gold Member Gold Chaser Site Supporter ++

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    Nationalism is absolutely necessary in the United States if you want to preserve a Constitutional Democratic Republic. If you believe in the Bill of Rights and the principles embodied in that document. If you love freedom and personal liberty. That's what we're defending, the Republic, liberty, the freedom embodied in the founding documents. All those things will most likely be gone forever if there is ever a one world government. That giant government boot on everyone's neck, everywhere, for a long, long time. When we pledge allegiance to the flag, we pledge loyalty to those founding principles, not to DC, not to the MIC, not the Fed.
     
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  35. Rusty Shackelford

    Rusty Shackelford Midas Member Midas Member

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    Take nationalism a step further... a good dose of isolationism for about a decade would straighten up a lot of our friends.

    However I am sure the MIC would not be in favor of us staying home.
     
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  36. All-in

    All-in Silver Member Silver Miner

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    Nations came from one small group, conquering another small group.

    After a few thousand years of this practise, your original small groups in their thousands, are now down to 200 big groups, known as nations.

    Nations are collective ownerships of individuals. With this ownership, the people at the top of the nation with religion, taxation, law making, police state, etc...Can live a life in extreme luxury.
     
  37. Bigjon

    Bigjon Silver Member Silver Miner Site Supporter ++

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    Show me where your republic is?
     
  38. Son of Gloin

    Son of Gloin Gold Member Gold Chaser Site Supporter ++

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    Oh, gawdalmighty, bj, it's pretty much a skeleton at this point in history, isn't it? I'm not willing to just abandon what's left, though. How about you?
     
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  39. Bigjon

    Bigjon Silver Member Silver Miner Site Supporter ++

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    I think we should resurrect it.

    By stopping the crooks in the district of criminals from categorizing we the people as US CITIZENS.
     
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  40. Son of Gloin

    Son of Gloin Gold Member Gold Chaser Site Supporter ++

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    Good enough, sir. How do we do that?
     

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