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Hoping someone can help identify this old silver bar

Discussion in 'Gold Silver (All things Metal)' started by vetruvian, Mar 16, 2016.



  1. vetruvian

    vetruvian New Member

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    First time to this forum. Please let me know if this is not the correct sub.

    Picked up the below poured silver bar the other day for spot + $1.00. I couldn't pass up a deal on a bar I have never seen. I have spent the last few days browsing the far reaches of the internet attempting to identify it with no joy. I was hoping someone here could help out. It appears to have "E195" on the top in reverse. You can see it clearly in a mirror.

    Characteristics:
    -'E195' is molded in reverse on the top of the bar
    -The 'E195' reads normally in a mirror
    -'999 FINE' is stamped upside-down on one side
    -'24 57' (assuming its meant to be 24.57) is stamped on the bottom
    -According to LCS scale the bar weighs in at 24.24 ozt
    -LCS tested and confirmed it is indeed silver

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    Any input/advice/tips are greatly appreciated. Thanks!
     
  2. Goldhedge

    Goldhedge Moderator Site Mgr Site Supporter

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    That's MINE! I lost it a while back... PM me for where to ship... Thanks!








    Oh and welcome to the board! I'm sure someone will have better input...
     
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  3. Chester-Copperpot

    Chester-Copperpot Gold Member Gold Chaser Site Supporter Platinum Bling

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    Could be a homemade pour. Does look pretty cool though.
     
  4. vetruvian

    vetruvian New Member

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    Thats one of the most likely explanations in my mind. However, I have been in correspondence with Ken Conaway (http://silveringot.blogspot.com/). He relayed the following:

    "The process of pouring into a mold in which the lettering would be raised to result in recessed impression on the casting is rare. Only one maker that I am aware of used this process, LYMAN".

    I have very little knowledge on smelting and pouring silver, so I would assume that recessed impressions are difficult to pull off successfully. If that is in fact true, a backyard/garage pour might be less likely. Which leads me to believe it is some sort of industrial use pour. Who knows, complete speculation at this point...
     
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  5. Chester-Copperpot

    Chester-Copperpot Gold Member Gold Chaser Site Supporter Platinum Bling

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    Hope it turns out to be a very rare vintage bar, that would be very cool. We have are own resident art bar guru SilverArt that's very clued up on art bars. He may be able to shine some light on it.
     
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  6. vetruvian

    vetruvian New Member

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    Apologies for my noobishness. How do I go about finding this SilverArt fellow?
     
  7. Scorpio

    Scorpio Скорпион Founding Member Board Elder Site Mgr Site Supporter ++

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    It looks a lot like the Lyman Lead Bars, used in multiple castings, whether fishing sinkers, bullets, etc.

    So it is possible that there was some silver kept around for special purposes, don't know.

    Noticeably though, there is no total silver content in the bar marked on it. Only ID type information.

    The first pic and the one of the .999 doesn't seem to fit as it doesn't have that trapezoidal shape from the mold the others do, yet it seems as though one can see the 195 below that.
     
    Last edited: Mar 17, 2016
  8. Mujahideen

    Mujahideen Black Member Midas Member

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    Put a magnet to it.
     
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  9. vetruvian

    vetruvian New Member

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    Tried this on day one. Magnet slides down the bar when placed at an angle. Absolutely no attraction.
     
  10. vetruvian

    vetruvian New Member

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    Just conducted an ice cube test on the bar. Melted extremely fast compared to the pan. After about 45 seconds, the bar was extremely cold when held in my hand. So the lack of magnetism, the ice cube test, and the trust I have in my LCS would lead me to believe that it is indeed silver.

    Video (sorry no explanation, I did it really quickly this morning before I left the house):

     
  11. Goldhedge

    Goldhedge Moderator Site Mgr Site Supporter

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    He's a member here. Look in 'Members' up top. Send a msg.

    Might also search the web using his name?
     
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  12. vetruvian

    vetruvian New Member

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    Thanks, I'll shoot him a PM.
     
  13. gringott

    gringott Killed then Resurrected Midas Member Site Supporter

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    Don't have a clue but it sure is cool. Thanks for sharing the pictures.
     
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  14. vetruvian

    vetruvian New Member

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    Of course! Thanks for the welcoming reception. Good community of enthusiasts you guys have here. Glad I stumbled across this forum!
     
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  15. Uglytruth

    Uglytruth Gold Member Gold Chaser

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    Funny he is usually the first guy to post about anything silver...... now he's MIA.
     
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  16. vetruvian

    vetruvian New Member

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    Maybe he is so busy trying to ID this one he has no time for the forum lol...
     
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  17. gringott

    gringott Killed then Resurrected Midas Member Site Supporter

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    He may be picking up the silver art bars I thew out the window the other day.
    I'll take a look and tell him to check here if he is out there.
     
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  18. Silver Art

    Silver Art Silver Art Bar collector Platinum Bling

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    I guess it is better late then never posting on this thread but unfortunately, I do not know anything about this bar. Based on the pictures and based on other poster posting on this thread, it does appear to be a poured bar but not one that is a commercial poured bar such as Engelhard. Maybe it is a "homemade" poured bar. If it is a homemade poured bar, then it will be nearly impossible to know who created it. All of this is just a WAG on my part because I truly do not know.
     
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  19. Bottom Feeder

    Bottom Feeder Hypophthalmichthys molitrix Gold Chaser Site Supporter

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    Opinion here, just my thoughts
    Looks like someone got ahold of an old lead foundry mold because they needed something to pour melted silver into. They’re lucky the mold didn’t blow up because it was meant for lead at 625° not silver at 1700. The E195 impression on the bottom is probably the mold number. The pitted look was most likely caused by erosion of the mold by lead pours. See how the number is pitted too. The difference in actual weight and the weight stamped being different would lead me to believe that they were stamped by a non-professional. I’d say someone melted down some silver scrap, took it to a metals buyer who assayed it, stamped it and brought it to market.

    JMHO


    BF
     
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  20. voodoo1951

    voodoo1951 Silver Member Silver Miner

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    Chinese Fake... here's a pic of the raw Tungsten before the boys melt & pour. China+Industries.jpg Just kidding! Very cool piece of metal. Looks like "Pirate Treasure" ... V51
     
  21. Bottom Feeder

    Bottom Feeder Hypophthalmichthys molitrix Gold Chaser Site Supporter

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    Tungsten, about the same density as gold
    Lead, about the same density as silver

    BF
     
  22. oldgaranddad

    oldgaranddad Gold Member Gold Chaser Site Supporter ++

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    While the bar is reminiscent of a Lyman or RCBS lead mold I think the key to identifying the mold might be the E195.

    I think the mold is a batch test mold for non-alloy carbon steel E195 alloy often used in tube steel applications. That would gel with what Bottom Feeder said about the temperature. A mold capable of withstanding molten E195 could easily handle molten silver.

    If this is true then it would be a homemade silver bar poured by someone who had expertise dealing with molten metals.

    Again, just a supposition here.
     
  23. southfork

    southfork Mother Lode Found Mother Lode

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    looks like a homemade bar to me, If you look at the number stamps they are of a different variety as if some one added the 999 to give the bar authenticity .
     
  24. Bottom Feeder

    Bottom Feeder Hypophthalmichthys molitrix Gold Chaser Site Supporter

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    Thanks for this link, vetruvian, I've not stumbled over that blog before. Lots of info there.

    BF
     
  25. 917601

    917601 Mother Lode Found Mother Lode

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    ....use a neodymium magnet, slide it down and it should slide down very, very slow, ( attraction). If it slides down quick, it is not silver. Yes, you read that right. Research the phenomenon, much posted here. That said, I believe it to be an old " jewelers " bar common in the late 70's and 80's. Recyclers ( many even operating out of their garages) poured thousands during the hey day, most for jewelers from melted scrap. If you were not around in those days, there was a silver hysteria, the recyclers made out best ( I knew one and marveled at his stories).
     
    Last edited: Apr 16, 2017
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  26. mayhem

    mayhem Silver Member Silver Miner Site Supporter

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    I just looked over at "the other forum" .us, thinking he might be a member there but no. Surprised, first time I have logged in there in 5 years.

    PS: Scorp, you haven't logged in there since may 19th 2010. :-)
     
  27. Bottom Feeder

    Bottom Feeder Hypophthalmichthys molitrix Gold Chaser Site Supporter

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    vetruvian.JPG
    Join date of Mar 16, 2016
    First post Mar 16, 2016
    Last post Mar 17, 2016
    Total posts 8

    Something tells me that vetruvian has left the building.

    BF
     
  28. 917601

    917601 Mother Lode Found Mother Lode

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    Bottom Feeder likes this.
  29. Bottom Feeder

    Bottom Feeder Hypophthalmichthys molitrix Gold Chaser Site Supporter

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    $750.00 - damn. I'm melting my junk silver RFN!

    E195.JPG
    This is getting insane.

    BF
     
  30. Bottom Feeder

    Bottom Feeder Hypophthalmichthys molitrix Gold Chaser Site Supporter

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    I'd rather have one of these:

    A Silver Collection.jpg
     

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