1. Same story, different day...........year ie more of the same fiat floods the world
    Dismiss Notice
  2. There are no markets
    Dismiss Notice
  3. Week of 6/24/2017 Closing prices & Chg Over Last Wk---- Gold $1256.40 Silver $16.64 Oil $43.01 USD $96.94
  4. "Spreading the ideas of freedom loving people on matters regarding high finance, politics, constructionist Constitution, and mental masturbation of all types"
    Dismiss Notice

What To Do With A Broken Illinois: Dissolve It

Discussion in 'Politics Forum (Local/National/World)' started by searcher, Jun 22, 2017.



  1. keef

    keef Пальто Crude Platinum Bling

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2011
    Messages:
    4,645
    Likes Received:
    3,524
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired Hoser
    Location:
    here
    They can 'pull the plug' anytime they want or NOT. I moved to a part of the country that is still being pumped with fresh (mmmmmmmmm/smells so GOOD) fiat and things here are fine.

    Not gonna say where, but it shows up BLUE on ur radar.

    (Its ground zero to one of the MAJOR 12 FED RESERVE banks) and the fiat here is fresh crisp green and plentiful while the red states are being dried up.

    Yeah, what else is a mother to do?

    chill.

    Enjoyed the ride w/u/guys.

    (Special NOD to Lt. Dan. He doesn't say alot here online, but dude hangs tough in a fire fight--kuddos man)
     
    Last edited: Jun 29, 2017
    Cigarlover likes this.
  2. ttazzman

    ttazzman Midas Member Midas Member Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2010
    Messages:
    4,635
    Likes Received:
    3,748
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    commercial/ industrial-construction/engineering/ma
    Location:
    mid-usa
    YEP!!!.....depending on how this plays out......bond holders vs entitlements at the state level......unprecidented
     
  3. GOLDBRIX

    GOLDBRIX God,Donald Trump,most in GIM2 I Trust. OTHERS-meh Site Supporter Platinum Bling

    Joined:
    Apr 4, 2010
    Messages:
    5,503
    Likes Received:
    5,229
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Funny the former potus ( intentionally lower case) FROM Illinois decided NOT to return to Chicago or Illinois.
     
    Ensoniq, Uglytruth and ttazzman like this.
  4. searcher

    searcher Mother Lode Found Site Supporter ++ Mother Lode

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2010
    Messages:
    132,117
    Likes Received:
    38,245
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Cigarlover likes this.
  5. Ensoniq

    Ensoniq Midas Member Midas Member Site Supporter ++

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2013
    Messages:
    6,238
    Likes Received:
    9,141
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Free Marketeer
    Location:
    North Carolina
    I would suggest doing nothing.

    Supposedly it's not legal for a state to declare bankruptcy and Obozo isn't around to funnel Federal tax money their way

    The failure process should be spectacular, illustrative, slow and painful, for the benefit of other tax and spend states
     
    Alton, Glasgow, the_shootist and 4 others like this.
  6. Cigarlover

    Cigarlover Gold Member Gold Chaser

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2011
    Messages:
    2,814
    Likes Received:
    3,650
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I still remember when Ct implemented its income tax. It was just atemp stopgap measure. Same year Foxwoods opened and the state was getting a 10% vig from them for 100 mil. If 100 mil wasnt going to solve things nothing will.
     
  7. Cigarlover

    Cigarlover Gold Member Gold Chaser

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2011
    Messages:
    2,814
    Likes Received:
    3,650
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Here's a hint for those states in trouble. When you promise high salaries and great benies to fill positions, you end up paying multiple times for the same position.
    You have leo who retires after 30 years and starts collecting his pension at 50 years old. The next guy who filled his position you have to pay for the next 30 years as well. Its possible you will have 2 people collecting a pension and a 3rd filling the position in many cases. Same with teachers but I think they have to work longer.
    How do you all pay for it? You steal money from hard working productive people in society so they cant afford to save and finance their own retirement. I suppose you think anyone who can afford to save a little is worth taxing more but eventually (Like now) you run our of other peoples money.
     
  8. Cigarlover

    Cigarlover Gold Member Gold Chaser

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2011
    Messages:
    2,814
    Likes Received:
    3,650
    Trophy Points:
    113
    what happened to PR anyway? I know they defaulted and then I never heard another word about the issue.
     
  9. searcher

    searcher Mother Lode Found Site Supporter ++ Mother Lode

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2010
    Messages:
    132,117
    Likes Received:
    38,245
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Cigarlover likes this.
  10. searcher

    searcher Mother Lode Found Site Supporter ++ Mother Lode

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2010
    Messages:
    132,117
    Likes Received:
    38,245
    Trophy Points:
    113
  11. searcher

    searcher Mother Lode Found Site Supporter ++ Mother Lode

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2010
    Messages:
    132,117
    Likes Received:
    38,245
    Trophy Points:
    113
    andial likes this.
  12. nickndfl

    nickndfl Midas Member Midas Member Site Supporter ++

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2011
    Messages:
    11,263
    Likes Received:
    8,878
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Florida
    Funny thing about Connecticut is there are a whole bunch of headquarters for healthcare companies. Great opportunity to start over fresh in many ways.
     
    Cigarlover likes this.
  13. andial

    andial Sir Midas Member Site Supporter ++

    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2010
    Messages:
    9,961
    Likes Received:
    9,919
    Trophy Points:
    113
  14. Cigarlover

    Cigarlover Gold Member Gold Chaser

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2011
    Messages:
    2,814
    Likes Received:
    3,650
    Trophy Points:
    113
    The peeps should demand that their paychecks get paid last. Il has state employee pay as a priority. It should be dead last. Cut the workforce by a huge percentage and then cut the pay and benies of state employees. Then no more welfare. Watch the poor flee or burn the place to the ground and then flee.
     
    searcher likes this.
  15. Uglytruth

    Uglytruth Gold Member Gold Chaser

    Joined:
    Apr 6, 2011
    Messages:
    3,998
    Likes Received:
    4,865
    Trophy Points:
    113
    THIS IS YOUR WAKE UP SHEEPLE! It's affecting you now. No go tell every liberal you know they have run out of other people's money!
     
    Alton and the_shootist like this.
  16. OverOver

    OverOver Silver Member Silver Miner Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2010
    Messages:
    695
    Likes Received:
    525
    Trophy Points:
    93
    So, Illinois and Puerto Rico can no longer fake it.

    Connecticut, New Jersey and Maine are in delayed fake it mode.

    A mixture of delayed fake it and fake it have pretty much been the
    standard for all the governments for sometime now.

    Maybe Vegas is going to have odds on whose next. A Pic 3 for the weekend. WTF?
     
    Cigarlover and Ensoniq like this.
  17. Cigarlover

    Cigarlover Gold Member Gold Chaser

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2011
    Messages:
    2,814
    Likes Received:
    3,650
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Step1- Default or file bankruptcy and get rid of all bond debt.


    Step2- Put emphasis on all citizens being armed and trained on how to defend themselves


    Step3- end to all entitlements


    Step4- cut all non essential gov employees. Reduce pension programs and let gov employees fund their own retirement


    Step5, firefighter positions, eliminated and only equipment is funded by the state otherwise an all volunteer system is fine.


    6- Do the same with police officers. They don’t stop any crime, they usually do the paperwork after the fact. We have a constitutional system of law enforcement, its called sheriffs dept.


    Step7-reduce taxes to reflect the new budget without all the socialist fluff


    After the slums are done being burned to the ground, the few entitlement recipients that are left will flee to other states. Once gone the slums can be bulldozed and a community garden can be planted to feed people. Volunteers can run it and donations can be accepted to plant fruit trees and to get the project started. Its going to be needed to feed people during the 20-30 year depression that will follow once the pissed off bankers are fired.


    Make it illegal to borrow money. If you can’t pay cash you can’t afford it. Bankers lose, people win.


    Road repairs go to the lowest bidder. No more “Rate” jobs where the gov mandates the hourly pay for the contracters employees.
     
    arminius likes this.
  18. latemetal

    latemetal Platinum Bling Platinum Bling

    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2010
    Messages:
    4,667
    Likes Received:
    2,476
    Trophy Points:
    113
    And tell the warmongers we are to broke to keep the military in the standards they have been accustomed to.
     
    Joe King and Cigarlover like this.
  19. the_shootist

    the_shootist The war is here on our doorstep! Midas Member Site Supporter ++

    Joined:
    May 31, 2015
    Messages:
    15,552
    Likes Received:
    15,406
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Oxygen Breather
    Location:
    Somewhere out there!
    I regret I have but one 'Like' to give for this epic post! Well played sir...well played!
     
  20. brosil

    brosil Gold Member Gold Chaser Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2010
    Messages:
    2,094
    Likes Received:
    1,692
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Oak Harbor, Ohio
    There is a procedure for a state that can't run itself . It devolves to a territory and is administered by the federal government until such time as it is capable of acting as a state again. All state government is gone, all state regulations are canceled, no pensions or state salaries are paid and all debtors and bondholders lose. Illinois is a good choice for this. Do that to Illinois and you might wake up the other states.
     
  21. Cigarlover

    Cigarlover Gold Member Gold Chaser

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2011
    Messages:
    2,814
    Likes Received:
    3,650
    Trophy Points:
    113
    would would one find that procedure?
     
  22. searcher

    searcher Mother Lode Found Site Supporter ++ Mother Lode

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2010
    Messages:
    132,117
    Likes Received:
    38,245
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Cigarlover likes this.
  23. Merlin

    Merlin Gold Member Gold Chaser Site Supporter ++

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2010
    Messages:
    2,352
    Likes Received:
    2,743
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    A woman I know gets an income tax refund every year that is $5000 more than she paid in the first place. I don't have a deal like that ;(
     
    Cigarlover likes this.
  24. latemetal

    latemetal Platinum Bling Platinum Bling

    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2010
    Messages:
    4,667
    Likes Received:
    2,476
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Any one want to go whaling in NJ? We'll be hunting the great White whale...
     
    searcher and Alton like this.
  25. nickndfl

    nickndfl Midas Member Midas Member Site Supporter ++

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2011
    Messages:
    11,263
    Likes Received:
    8,878
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Florida
    This sounds like the principles on which America was founded.
     
  26. brosil

    brosil Gold Member Gold Chaser Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2010
    Messages:
    2,094
    Likes Received:
    1,692
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Oak Harbor, Ohio
    I have to admit I don't remember where I read it. It's been some years since I did. It was something about territorial governance. It was something about a territory being made a state and not managing to govern itself. It wasn't meant for something like this but it should still apply.
     
    Cigarlover likes this.
  27. Cigarlover

    Cigarlover Gold Member Gold Chaser

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2011
    Messages:
    2,814
    Likes Received:
    3,650
    Trophy Points:
    113
    There was a couple around here that moved last year but they stayed single while having children so everything was free. The hospital bills and all healthcare afterwards, food stamps and at the end of the year she would get the earned income credit for not working and got a refund for over 10k. At the same time because he was the baby daddy his healthcare became free as well for 1 year.
    Another neighbor has a daughter who pumps out kids like a pez dispenser, I think she's on number 6 or 7 now and she just signs them over top whoever needs some help. Mom usually gets a few for 6 months at a time.
    Then of course the single mothers also sign up for college for free and get expense money for school but never really go to school (Usually around 5 k for expenses) They do however get a car and I think the computer is thrown in for free as well.
     
  28. Cigarlover

    Cigarlover Gold Member Gold Chaser

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2011
    Messages:
    2,814
    Likes Received:
    3,650
    Trophy Points:
    113
    So how does everyone think this is all going to play out? I heard the Gov already agreed to tax increases. That'll fix things LOL.
     
  29. Buck

    Buck Fabian Society Gold Chaser

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2011
    Messages:
    2,465
    Likes Received:
    1,907
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Not very well, that's obvious
    How deep can a state go after personal assets such as bank accounts?
    I'd like to presume they could go after any 401k's that they, as a State, control, but can they go after private 401k's?
    Can a State confiscate SDB's or are banks only available for the Fed Govt to take from?
     
    Cigarlover likes this.
  30. Cigarlover

    Cigarlover Gold Member Gold Chaser

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2011
    Messages:
    2,814
    Likes Received:
    3,650
    Trophy Points:
    113
    http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-...s-historic-32-tax-increase-governor-vows-veto

    So at a time when your state is in ruins the dems still want to give more to those who don't pay into the system in the first place. Absolute geniuses running that state.
     
  31. Buck

    Buck Fabian Society Gold Chaser

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2011
    Messages:
    2,465
    Likes Received:
    1,907
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    If politics worked as designed, we'd not have career politicians
     
    Uglytruth likes this.
  32. OverOver

    OverOver Silver Member Silver Miner Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2010
    Messages:
    695
    Likes Received:
    525
    Trophy Points:
    93
    I would have to say bravo for the Governor. I mean who has ever been a governor of a state
    and closed down the beaches for the 4th of July and then takes his family to the shore. And
    more than likely accompanied by a security detail and aides carried with taxpayer's money.

    DDw43hsUQAAvQHo.jpg

    Drastic, financial predicaments need innovative ideas like this.
     
    Alton, Ensoniq and searcher like this.
  33. Cigarlover

    Cigarlover Gold Member Gold Chaser

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2011
    Messages:
    2,814
    Likes Received:
    3,650
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Why cant people go on the beach because the gov is shut down? They had to shut down the beach but the Gov 2nd house at the beach could remain open? They had enough money for that and his security detail and probably a cooler full of hot dogs and a personal chef to cook them for him too.
     
    searcher likes this.
  34. searcher

    searcher Mother Lode Found Site Supporter ++ Mother Lode

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2010
    Messages:
    132,117
    Likes Received:
    38,245
    Trophy Points:
    113
    It's a state park: http://www.state.nj.us/dep/parksandforests/parks/island.html

    Nice get away from the beaches with boardwalks.
     
  35. searcher

    searcher Mother Lode Found Site Supporter ++ Mother Lode

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2010
    Messages:
    132,117
    Likes Received:
    38,245
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Fury as Chris Christie brazenly lounges on a deserted public beach in New Jersey after he CLOSED them all for the holiday weekend amid budget dispute - AND he used a state helicopter to get there
    • Due to the government shutdown amid the state budget standoff, people were unable to enjoy Island Beach State Park this Independence Day weekend
    • But the Governor and his family are nestled nicely at the beach house funded by the state for a family-packed weekend by the water
    • Photos show the governor and his family almost microscopic on the deserted beach
    • Christie has been using the state helicopter to go to and from the beach house to Trenton to talk about the shutdown
    • And many on social media were not pleased their plans were cancelled


    Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4660156/Governor-Chris-Christie-family-lounge-Island-Beach.html#ixzz4ll2wxC2U
    Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook
     
    Alton and Ensoniq like this.
  36. latemetal

    latemetal Platinum Bling Platinum Bling

    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2010
    Messages:
    4,667
    Likes Received:
    2,476
    Trophy Points:
    113
  37. searcher

    searcher Mother Lode Found Site Supporter ++ Mother Lode

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2010
    Messages:
    132,117
    Likes Received:
    38,245
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Really makes you think..........doesn't it?!
     
    Alton, Cigarlover and Uglytruth like this.
  38. searcher

    searcher Mother Lode Found Site Supporter ++ Mother Lode

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2010
    Messages:
    132,117
    Likes Received:
    38,245
    Trophy Points:
    113
  39. Ensoniq

    Ensoniq Midas Member Midas Member Site Supporter ++

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2013
    Messages:
    6,238
    Likes Received:
    9,141
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Free Marketeer
    Location:
    North Carolina
    Christie

    "Qu'ils mangent de la brioche"
     
    searcher likes this.
  40. searcher

    searcher Mother Lode Found Site Supporter ++ Mother Lode

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2010
    Messages:
    132,117
    Likes Received:
    38,245
    Trophy Points:
    113
    The Broken States of the Union


    -- Published: Monday, 3 July 2017

    By David Haggith

    For the first time in US history a handful of US states is teetering on the edge of bankruptcy. Illinois is about to be downgraded to junk bond status, which will turn its financial problems catastrophic overnight. Illinois cannot possibly pay its accumulated debt, its unpaid medicaid expenses and its future retirement obligations, so bankruptcy almost certainly will be its only way out.

    Main, Connecticut, Kentucky and California are also caught in chronic budget deadlocks that may lead to bankruptcy as a solution for dodging their entitlement obligations. Bear in mind they’re called “entitlements” because it’s money promised to you that you already put in the work to earn. It’s your retirement. Illinois, for example, has over $200 billion in pension obligations that will never be paid … or that can only be paid at a greatly diminished level worked out in some form of effective bankruptcy.

    That’s a problem that is only solved by turning it into a worse problem for others. Illinois will end its problems by making certain that for the next quarter century, a good portion of the now retiring baby-boom population is dirt poor and must be carried by the younger population as dead wait (if not exterminated) because the retirement they planned in order to responsibly carry themselves through their final years isn’t there.

    Instead of the state not being able to pay its bills, bankruptcy means that hundreds of thousands of retirees won’t be paying theirs, which means the people they owe money to will be going broke, and so the problem trickles down. State bankruptcy merely shifts the burden so that legislators don’t have to deal with it but you do. And it’s inevitable because the alternative is that you pay for it through much higher taxes. The state is you.

    The Federal government won’t be solving the state budget problems either because it plans on dumping heavier medicaid expenses back on all states as it repeals Obamacare to help solve its own budget problems amid its own deadlock. Like the states, its own Social Security funds are going broke, so it faces its own massive entitlement problems. And, if it bails out one failing state, it will be expected to bail out all others that face such problems.

    With Illinois effectively reaching bankruptcy and a likely catastrophic credit downgrade this summer, the problem finally starts coming to a head where everyone is forced to see how decades of government debt accumulation end, and that end looks something like this in real terms:

    Illinois, as the bellwether example, has already stopped paying the contractors who fix roads and other infrastructure. That means the contractors will now stop fixing the roads and won’t be paying their employees, and broken roads don’t get corn and beef to market. Illinois has stopped paying doctors. That means the doctors will stop fixing people. Illinois has refused to pay its lottery winners (even though it took the money from all the suckered ticket buyers). That means there will no more lottery to raise state money because there will be no more ticket buyers. That means the state’s budget problems just got worse, so Illinois soon won’t be paying state employees or pensioners.

    It sucks when your entire state goes broke. You see, you can keep kidding yourself — as our entire nation has for the decades that I’ve been complaining about this — that you’re going to take care of everyone on welfare with endless debt spending or that you’re going to maintain huge military power to control the world with debt spending; but eventually you pile up state or federal debts so high that you wind up not paying anyone, including the welfare recipients or the soldiers in your military.

    Like the US government, the State of Illinois has been operating without a real budget for more than two years, operating dysfunctionally during that time by court-ordered stop-gap measures because the legislature is deadlocked as politicians refuse to accept reality; so, Illinois has now reached the same financial status as Puerto Rico.

    Illinois is grappling with a full-fledged financial crisis and not even the lottery is safe – with Republican Gov. Bruce Rauner warning the state is entering “banana republic” territory…. Reports have suggested the state could be the first to attempt to declare Chapter 9 bankruptcy — but under the law, that’s impossible unless Congress gets involved….. “Illinois is the fiscal model of what not to do,” Rep. Peter Roskam, R-Ill., told Fox News, while not commenting on the bankruptcy question. “This avoidance in behavior toward dealing with our challenges is what leads to the devastating impacts we are seeing today.” (Fox News)

    And, for Illinois, the problem is that they cannot kick the can down the road any further because the next credit downgrade will make it impossible for them afford their current debt, which is really already impossible. Creditors will become much fewer and more expensive when Illinois becomes the first state of the union to hit junk-bond status and maybe the first to declare bankruptcy since the Great Depression, when Arkansas found itself “plain flat broke” and became the only state to ever default on its bonds (showing it can happen), effectively declaring its own bankruptcy, even if not sorted out through the federal courts. (Eventually, years later, Arkansas paid their bond holders.) Already, the Illinois ten-year bond yields are at 5.2%; but the world becomes exponentially worse when you hit junk-bond status and entire large institutions become outlawed from financing you.

    “We have a very real deadline looming,” Senate Republican Leader Christine Radogno told Fox News. “The alternative to not finding a compromise will be devastating to Illinois.”

    With or without bankruptcy, the state is already badly defaulting on its obligations. Bankruptcy is just a more orderly way of deciding who is not going to get paid and by how much. But the not getting paid part? Already here, and nearly a dozen states are falling into this kind of severe condition. The issue with state bankruptcy is that bankruptcy court is federal, putting state budgetary sovereignty under state’s rights under federal determination; but it can be done:

    David Skeel, a law professor at the University of Pennsylvania … wrote outright that, “The constitutionality of bankruptcy-for-states is beyond serious dispute.” The key, as he sees it, is that bankruptcy would be entirely voluntary, which should eliminate any concerns about Federal intrusion on state sovereignty. (Zero Hedge)

    And it has been done … long ago … and is now here again.

    Economic denial is about to square up to economic reality, and reality always wins! Eventually, economic reality forces your hand in a catastrophic solution because of your profligate ways. Eventually, you end up as a truly cashless society. This summer, we get to watch that play out in Illinois to get a sense of what it will look like elsewhere.

    At the end of the day, a broken state is a broken you.

    The motto of the State of Illinois, Land of Lincoln, who held this great national union together, is “”State Sovereignty, National Union.”

    Illinois is all of us.

    http://thegreatrecession.info/blog/broken-states-union/

    http://news.goldseek.com/GoldSeek/1499091300.php
     
    Cigarlover likes this.

Share This Page