1. Same story, different day...........year ie more of the same fiat floods the world
    Dismiss Notice
  2. There are no markets
    Dismiss Notice
  3. Week of 6/24/2017 Closing prices & Chg Over Last Wk---- Gold $1256.40 Silver $16.64 Oil $43.01 USD $96.94
  4. "Spreading the ideas of freedom loving people on matters regarding high finance, politics, constructionist Constitution, and mental masturbation of all types"
    Dismiss Notice

Who had a "Gut Feeling" about Bitcoin?

Discussion in 'Topical Discussions (In Depth)' started by Fatboy, May 22, 2017.



  1. Joe King

    Joe King Gold Member Gold Chaser

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2010
    Messages:
    4,781
    Likes Received:
    4,445
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Instant Gratification Land
    Then it's going the wrong way. Back up to $8127.
    ...and everything doesn't have to have intrinsic value. Can you not understand that extrinsic value is a thing, too? In fact, that's what gives gold most of its value. It only has intrinsic value to those that actually make use of the metal. To everyone else it can only have extrinsic value. Same as btc does.
     
  2. Area51

    Area51 Silver Miner Seeker

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2012
    Messages:
    800
    Likes Received:
    476
    Trophy Points:
    63

    Created out of thin air and backed by ZERO - - just like the USD and the Zimbabwe dollar.

    Only a matter of time until all three reach their intrinsic value of worthlessness.
     
  3. Area51

    Area51 Silver Miner Seeker

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2012
    Messages:
    800
    Likes Received:
    476
    Trophy Points:
    63
    If you could find a sucker dumb enough to give you 6.3oz of gold in exchange for ONE (1) bitcoin, that would be the greatest heist you'll ever make in your lifetime.

    Other than the degenerate speculators, who in their right mind wouldn't dump their bitcoins now in exchange for gold?

    Much like the degenerates at the casino who get up a bit of money but just can't pull themselves away and cash out - - sooner or later they all end up at ZERO.
     
  4. viking

    viking Silver Member Silver Miner

    Joined:
    May 12, 2010
    Messages:
    1,260
    Likes Received:
    964
    Trophy Points:
    113
    A while back, someone bought a pizza for 10,000 Bitcoins...
     
  5. solarion

    solarion Gold Member Gold Chaser Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2013
    Messages:
    4,075
    Likes Received:
    6,195
    Trophy Points:
    113
    All that says to me is that perhaps it's time to get TF out. CME is just organized crime as far as I'm concerned.
     
  6. Joe King

    Joe King Gold Member Gold Chaser

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2010
    Messages:
    4,781
    Likes Received:
    4,445
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Instant Gratification Land
    Intrinsic value is a nice thing, but is that the only kind of value you recognize in anything? Extrinsic value is a value that is determined externally of the thing itself. Why is that a problem? Gold has both intrinsic and extrinsic value. In fact, the majority of gold's value is extrinsic and to the investor its value is only extrinsic, just like BTC's.
     
  7. Area51

    Area51 Silver Miner Seeker

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2012
    Messages:
    800
    Likes Received:
    476
    Trophy Points:
    63

    A run up in extrinsic "value" is a sure indicator of a bubble, my friend. It's based on emotions, - - the worst human emotions - - greed and the herd mentality, fearful of being "left out".

    I'm always amazed - - and amused - - that so many suckers get caught up in hysteria of each new bubble and convince themselves "this time it's different". This particular one is even more comical because it isn't even a tangible item.

    The intrinsic value of gold has been recognized for THOUSANDS of years. Is anyone naive enough to suggest bitcoins will be anything more than a brief footnote in history a thousand years from now?

    Currencies with ZERO intrinsic value have ALWAYS failed, my friend. Always have, always will.
     
  8. Joe King

    Joe King Gold Member Gold Chaser

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2010
    Messages:
    4,781
    Likes Received:
    4,445
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Instant Gratification Land
    It certainly can be. Also, btc had a run to $250 and then fell back. Then ran to a little over a grand and then fell back. Then ran up to its current amount. There's certainly a chance for it to fall back again.
    ....but would you call each of those a bubble? It's only been about 5 years for all that to happen.

    As @solarion pointed out, it's the non-tangible aspect of it that gives it its value. It's whole purpose was to be able to exchange value online in a peer-to-peer manner. It was never intended to be tangible as tangible items cannot be transfered via the internet. Is it really that difficult of an idea to grasp? That someone designed a method of transferring value on the internet? IMHO it was just a matter of time.

    Yes, gold is a useful thing, but I don't really care if btc is around in 1000 years. If it works that long, great. If it doesn't, oh well, they'll find something that works better for them.
    ...and is it really so critical to our lives that it is of critical importance that what we happen to use as money still be thing 1000 years from now? Maybe btc will be around that long. Who knows? Tally Sticks lasted nearly 800 years I believe. So it is theoretically within reason that a currency could last 1000 years. We'll just have to wait and see. Maybe we can have a reunion then and buy each other a beer? lol



    Ok, but it's working now and for the foreseeable future.
     
    solarion likes this.
  9. solarion

    solarion Gold Member Gold Chaser Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2013
    Messages:
    4,075
    Likes Received:
    6,195
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Seems weird that someone would refer to those that invested in an instrument that has appreciated > 820,000 percent in 7 years...as "suckers", but whatever floats your boat I guess.
     
  10. Area51

    Area51 Silver Miner Seeker

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2012
    Messages:
    800
    Likes Received:
    476
    Trophy Points:
    63
    That ability already exists with interac e-transfer.

    MUCH more efficient than bitcoin could ever hope to be - - no long waits for the transaction to be processed and no ridiculous "processing fee" either.

    Perhaps the technology will reach your little village at some point in the future.
     
  11. Joe King

    Joe King Gold Member Gold Chaser

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2010
    Messages:
    4,781
    Likes Received:
    4,445
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Instant Gratification Land
    lol

    That is in no way the same thing.

    To send an Interac e-Transfer, all you need is an email address, online access to your bank account at a participating financial institution and the email address or mobile phone number of the person that you are sending money to.
    http://www.interac.ca/en/faq#faq_137


    I bet the recipient has to have an account at a "participating financial institution" too. lol


    Did you even read or understand the part about peer to peer? interac is anything but peer to peer. Try again!
     
  12. Area51

    Area51 Silver Miner Seeker

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2012
    Messages:
    800
    Likes Received:
    476
    Trophy Points:
    63
    What happened to your proclamation about ignoring my comments? Looks like your word is just as worthless as these crypto currencies.

    If an 820,000% increase over seven years doesn't immediately scream BUBBLE then "sucker" doesn't begin to describe how foolishly naive you truly are, my friend.
     
  13. Area51

    Area51 Silver Miner Seeker

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2012
    Messages:
    800
    Likes Received:
    476
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Do you not have online access? Do you not have an email? Are you a hobo without a bank account?
     
  14. Joe King

    Joe King Gold Member Gold Chaser

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2010
    Messages:
    4,781
    Likes Received:
    4,445
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Instant Gratification Land
    So you don't understand peer to peer?
    ...and now you're in favor of gov fiat? Electronic gov fiat at that. Who knew you were such a fan boy? I thought you said it was bad stuff?
     
  15. solarion

    solarion Gold Member Gold Chaser Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2013
    Messages:
    4,075
    Likes Received:
    6,195
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I am ignoring your comments "friend", just get a kick out of seeing one half of a conversation. I never gave you my word on anything. I put you on ignore because I find your comments to be of low quality.

    ...and this illustrates perfectly why I don't generally bother replying to you...you're intellectually dishonest. You ignored what I said and instead responded to what I did not say. Whether bitcoin = bubble or not has no bearing on how silly you sound calling people "sucker" when they've made out extremely well.
     
    Joe King likes this.
  16. #48Fan

    #48Fan Silver Member Silver Miner

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2014
    Messages:
    401
    Likes Received:
    253
    Trophy Points:
    63
    That's the thing, Solarion, BTC could go up to eleventy billion dollars each and folks like 51 will still be shilling the bubble thing. As long as we are all still alive, they will always have this "argument", lmao. Bubble, bubble, death of, crash, just wait, based on nothing, for stoopid people, etc, etc.
     
  17. solarion

    solarion Gold Member Gold Chaser Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2013
    Messages:
    4,075
    Likes Received:
    6,195
    Trophy Points:
    113
    He tosses around words like "bubble" and "sucker" and terms like "degenerate speculator" when all he really means is "I dislike bitcoin and those who use them".

    The debt market is a bubble...I mean 36 years of winning? That ain't gonna happen without some serious hopium combined with manipulation. Wiki says the global debt market was over $82 trillion in 2009 and the US was 44% of that. Now that's what a bubble looks like. Bitcoin? I've no idea what free markets will ultimately decide a single bitcoin should be worth, 8200 could be near the top, or just the beginning...we may not know for years. I do know that everyone thus far that has proclaimed bitcoin dead and buried has been proven wrong.
     
  18. Area51

    Area51 Silver Miner Seeker

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2012
    Messages:
    800
    Likes Received:
    476
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Bitcoin is no more "peer to peer" than an e transfer is. Both require a third party to process it. Actually, the difference is the bank will process the e transfer for FREE while the bitcoin network charges a ridiculous processing fee of 5% to 10%.

    Any currency - - the USD, bitcoins, Zimbabwe dollars - - that has ZERO backing is ultimately worthless junk. Inevitably they all end up returning to their intrinsic value of ZERO.

    It's laughable how you can recognize the world's reserve currency is worthless but then turn around and spout how wonderful another currency that's also backed by absolutely ZERO and fluctuates wildly due to the influence of degenerate speculators is such a wonderful thing.

    It defies logic how anyone could trust anonymous online characters any more than trust characters at the fed.

    I believe the term for it is "willful blindness".
     
  19. #48Fan

    #48Fan Silver Member Silver Miner

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2014
    Messages:
    401
    Likes Received:
    253
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Many people are using that "willful blindness" to turn their "worthless" BTC into PM's. Think about that. I can take virtual "air" and turn it into hard currency. Will it last forever? Nothing does. I'm sorry you feel like you missed the boat, 51. But imho, I believe this thing is just getting started. You can just sit there and bash if you want while I'm laughing PM's all the way into my safe.

    On a side note: Cryptocurrencies are backed by mathematics/algorithms on the blockchain. You can bash that idea all you want as well, just quit saying it is backed by "nothing".
     
  20. CrimsonGuardJay

    CrimsonGuardJay Silver Member Silver Miner

    Joined:
    May 16, 2014
    Messages:
    1,747
    Likes Received:
    1,196
    Trophy Points:
    113


    We’re referring to the men, many that there are, that getting involved now, or in recent months, as suckers. Obviously if someone had the “retarded luck” to just buy $50 in this shit 5 years ago, they are smart enough, but people buying in at $3k? Nope.
     
  21. CrimsonGuardJay

    CrimsonGuardJay Silver Member Silver Miner

    Joined:
    May 16, 2014
    Messages:
    1,747
    Likes Received:
    1,196
    Trophy Points:
    113
  22. solarion

    solarion Gold Member Gold Chaser Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2013
    Messages:
    4,075
    Likes Received:
    6,195
    Trophy Points:
    113
    You mean like the poor "suckers" goldie pointed to that stupidly bought that "shit" at 7500 a couple weeks back? Yeah...poor them...they should have plowed that fake ass fiat into the stock market and lost a bundle instead of gaining 9%.

    The trouble with the bitcoin haters is they never seem to apply any reality checks. Bitcoin was 963 on January 1 of 2017. You didn't have to buy 5 years ago...you could have bought 5 freaking months ago and be up 335%. If you didn't listen to the stupid shits that rant and rave against bitcoin you could have bought on January 1 of THIS YEAR and you'd be up 748%.

    That means if you dumped your cash into bitcoin on January 1 2017 rather than directly into PMs you could now have over SEVEN TIMES as much PMs as you would have.
     
    Last edited: Nov 23, 2017
    Joe King likes this.
  23. solarion

    solarion Gold Member Gold Chaser Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2013
    Messages:
    4,075
    Likes Received:
    6,195
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Looks like a phishing scam. Sucks, but these scams were not invented with crypto currencies and they won't go away anytime soon. Be careful out there.
     
  24. Area51

    Area51 Silver Miner Seeker

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2012
    Messages:
    800
    Likes Received:
    476
    Trophy Points:
    63

    You can't be serious with that asinine comment. Please, tell me you're just joking. There's no way anyone could be dumb enough to suggest a currency backed by gold is the same as a currency backed by "mathematical algorithms".
     
  25. solarion

    solarion Gold Member Gold Chaser Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2013
    Messages:
    4,075
    Likes Received:
    6,195
    Trophy Points:
    113
    We had a currency backed by gold...banksters cheated that system too. It was child's play to create more receipts than they had gold to cover and then convince the stupid sheep that the receipts for money...were themselves money.
     
  26. Area51

    Area51 Silver Miner Seeker

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2012
    Messages:
    800
    Likes Received:
    476
    Trophy Points:
    63
    That's it exactly.

    It's a classic Ponzi scheme - - constantly needs suckers getting in at the bottom to keep the charade going.

    Same kind of rhetoric as with all other Ponzis "you'd better get in now before you miss out on more profits". Same kind of absurd returns as with all other Ponzis "820,000% in seven years....300% in six months".

    No idea how people constantly get duped into these horseshit schemes. Greed and stupidity is a horrific combination.
     
  27. solarion

    solarion Gold Member Gold Chaser Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2013
    Messages:
    4,075
    Likes Received:
    6,195
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Oh boy, here we go with the incorrect definitions again. No doubt this will be a waste of time, but here goes.

    Pon·zi scheme
    ˈpänzē ˌskēm/
    noun
    noun: Ponzi scheme; plural noun: Ponzi schemes
    1. a form of fraud in which belief in the success of a nonexistent enterprise is fostered by the payment of quick returns to the first investors from money invested by later investors.
    https://www.google.com/search?q=ponzi+scheme+definition&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&client=firefox-b-1-ab
    https://www.investopedia.com/terms/p/ponzischeme.asp
    http://www.dictionary.com/browse/ponzi?s=t

    Ummm...nope, doesn't fit sorry.
     
  28. Joe King

    Joe King Gold Member Gold Chaser

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2010
    Messages:
    4,781
    Likes Received:
    4,445
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Instant Gratification Land
    It's not "worthless", just "worth less" than it was before. Sure, if there is no one else to trade with, a dollar bill is probably more valuable as fire starter.
    ...but until that time, it is in fact "worth" something due to the fact it can be used to acquire goods and services.

    That said, do I like that we are forced to use fiat? No, but that's pretty much all there has been all my life. What should I do, choose to starve because the gov won't let us use Au for money without taking a huge loss? Is that what you do? Or do you trade in fiat?

    BTC is just something that is in the Peoples domain that can be used as a currency on the internet. No more, no less.


    Again, it's just currency designed to be used on the internet. How could something like that be tangible?
    ...and again, seeing as you keep ignoring this fact, how could it be "backed" by a warehouse full of gold or anything else as that would give the govs of the World a target to go after in their quest to shut it down. Remember Liberty Dollar? Or are you too young to remember that?



    Because it's not based on trusting any one character, but lots of unknown to each other characters who all must agree. Ever heard of safety in numbers?


    Exactly. If you give 'em the ability to abuse the system, they will abuse the system.
     
  29. Joe King

    Joe King Gold Member Gold Chaser

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2010
    Messages:
    4,781
    Likes Received:
    4,445
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Instant Gratification Land
    Yea, it's amazing how people so often don't understand what the terms they use actually mean.
    ...and insist that everyone else use their definitions. lol
     
    solarion likes this.
  30. #48Fan

    #48Fan Silver Member Silver Miner

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2014
    Messages:
    401
    Likes Received:
    253
    Trophy Points:
    63
    I never said that. Can you read the words coming out of my keyboard? I was only telling you what cryptos are backed by. I wasn't comparing them to anything. Please show me a currency backed by gold, since you brought it up for whatever reason. Cryptos are, indeed, backed by something. Something much more tangible than "full faith and credit". Do you get it now?
     
  31. #48Fan

    #48Fan Silver Member Silver Miner

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2014
    Messages:
    401
    Likes Received:
    253
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Yeah, those poor saps that bought at $3k are only up almost 300% in three months. Hmmm, 2.3 oz AU then, or 6.3 oz AU now? Tough question.
     
  32. Silver Art

    Silver Art Silver Art Bar collector Platinum Bling

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2011
    Messages:
    4,170
    Likes Received:
    2,349
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Silver Art Bar Hoor
    Location:
    Tennessee
    Looking back when I was in bitcoin, I will admit that I was disappointed that I got out of bitcoin way too early at $1870, however, I am glad to I made some money from bitcoin. I am also glad that I made even more money from Bitshares. I made more money in Bitshares than I did in Bitcoin. As of right now, I am not in bitcoin and I do not plan to get back in Bitcoin. I am still in cryptos since I still have half of my Bitshares investment. I still have some skin in the crypto game and if bitcoin (and cryptos in general) go to $0, then I can still sleep well at night since I took a farily large profit from my cryto investments that had triple digit positive returns. I just eating popcorn and watching the crypto scene play out.
     
    Joe King likes this.
  33. Area51

    Area51 Silver Miner Seeker

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2012
    Messages:
    800
    Likes Received:
    476
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Instead of doubling down on stupidity, it's ok to be honest here, my friend.

    Your continued insistence that "mathematical algorithms" backing a currency carry any more weight than the promise of the US government backing a currency is laughable.

    WTF can you redeem your bitcoins for - - a printout of "mathematical algorithms"? That's every bit as worthless as a hand shake from Jan Yellen.
     
  34. Area51

    Area51 Silver Miner Seeker

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2012
    Messages:
    800
    Likes Received:
    476
    Trophy Points:
    63
    I'm curious to know why you got out of bitcoins when you did and especially why you never plan on getting into it again.
     
  35. Silver Art

    Silver Art Silver Art Bar collector Platinum Bling

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2011
    Messages:
    4,170
    Likes Received:
    2,349
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Silver Art Bar Hoor
    Location:
    Tennessee

    Honestly, I thought that $2000 was going to be the top and I wanted to get out before it reached that. I was up 281% at that point and I was satisfied with it. As to why I am not getting back into it again, I got scared with it at the current $8000+ level. I am not comfortable getting into Bitcoin at this point. I still like cryptos in general and I am still in Bitshares but I did not want to get too greedy and decided to take profits in Bitcoin and in some profits in Bitshares.
     
  36. solarion

    solarion Gold Member Gold Chaser Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2013
    Messages:
    4,075
    Likes Received:
    6,195
    Trophy Points:
    113
    For the 100th time, you can easily redeem bitcoin for GOLD. Why is it so hard for you to understand?

    It doesn't matter if you personally think bitcoin is worthless. The guys over at Provident, JMBullion, Silver.com, etc do NOT think that. Not only do they accept bitcoin for PMs, but they give you a better rate using bitcoin than they do if you use a bankster credit card.
     
    #48Fan likes this.
  37. SilverCity

    SilverCity Gold Member Gold Chaser

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2010
    Messages:
    2,860
    Likes Received:
    2,289
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    retired aerospace
    Location:
    New Babylon
    Live Stream - BREAKING - THE HACK IS REAL - DANGER!! Listen Up Crypto People!! BIG TROUBLE




    Protect yer passwords...

    SC
     
  38. Area51

    Area51 Silver Miner Seeker

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2012
    Messages:
    800
    Likes Received:
    476
    Trophy Points:
    63

    You're badly confused, my friend.

    You can BUY gold with bitcoins - - just as you can BUY gold with USDs. But you CANNOT redeem bitcoins for gold, just as you CANNOT redeem USDs for gold.

    Please educate yourself before attempting to comment further.
     
  39. solarion

    solarion Gold Member Gold Chaser Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2013
    Messages:
    4,075
    Likes Received:
    6,195
    Trophy Points:
    113
    lol sure buddy, let's play stupid verb games. "Redeem" vs "buy".

    This would be a hoot if you were trying to be funny, as it is it's just sad. Even if you had a stack of gold certificates you cannot "redeem" them for gold either. Hell I have a couple and some silver certificates...what do you suppose I'll get if I trot them down to the local federal reserve branch? Gold? Silver? ...really dude?

    I don't give a shit if you want to call it "redeeming" or "buying". You swap your crappy FRNs for bitcoin, wait awhile, and then get a whole bunch more gold or silver than you would have if you'd gone straight from FRNs to PMs.

    If you'd like to get into a discussion about "lawful money" vs "legal tender" then that's fine, but this is not the place for it.
     
    Last edited: Nov 23, 2017
  40. solarion

    solarion Gold Member Gold Chaser Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2013
    Messages:
    4,075
    Likes Received:
    6,195
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Okay...I'm 12 mins in and he's still babbling about two factor authorization and cell phones. Is he talking about hacking exchanges/websites?

    If people are dumb enough to store cryptos on exchanges...they'll be robbed, you don't need a video to tell you that. Cryptos have not fixed human nature, some people do in fact want to rob you.
     

Share This Page