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A liberal elite still luring us towards the abyss

Scorpio

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#1
A liberal elite still luring us towards the abyss

27 January 2019


A group of 30 respected intellectuals, writers and historians has published a manifesto bewailing the imminent collapse of Europe and its supposed Enlightenment values of liberalism and rationalism. The idea of Europe, they warn, “is falling apart before our eyes”, as Britain prepares for Brexit and “populist and nationalist” parties look poised to make sweeping gains in elections across the continent.
The short manifesto has been published in the liberal elite’s European house journals, newspapers such as the Guardian. “We must now fight for the idea of Europe or perish beneath the waves of populism,” their document reads. Failure means “resentment, hatred and their cortege of sad passions will surround and submerge us.”
Unless the tide can be turned, elections across the European Union will be “the most calamitous that we have ever known: victory for the wreckers; disgrace for those who still believe in the legacy of Erasmus, Dante, Goethe, and Comenius; disdain for intelligence and culture; explosions of xenophobia and antisemitism; disaster”.
The manifesto was penned by Bernard-Henri Levy, the French philosopher and devotee of Alexis de Tocqueville, a theorist of classical liberalism. Its signatories include novelists Ian McEwan, Milan Kundera and Salman Rushdie, the historian Simon Shama, and Nobel prize laureates Svetlana Alexievitch, Herta Müller, Orhan Pamuk and Elfriede Jelinek.
Though unnamed, their European political heroes appear to be Emmanuel Macron of France, currently trying to crush the popular, anti-austerity protests of the Yellow Vests, and German chancellor Angela Merkel, manning the barricades for the liberal elite against a resurgence of the nationalist right in Germany.
Let us set aside, on this occasion, the strange irony that several of the manifesto’s signatories – not least Henri-Levy himself – have a well-known passion for Israel, a state that has always rejected the universal principles ostensibly embodied in liberal ideology and that instead openly espouses the kind of ethnic nationalism that nearly tore Europe apart in two world wars last century.
Instead let us focus on their claim that “populism and nationalism” are on the verge of slaying Europe’s liberal democratic tradition and the values held dearest by this distinguished group. Their hope presumably is that their manifesto will serve as a wake-up call before things take an irreversible turn for the worse.
Liberalism’s collapse
In one sense, their diagnosis is correct: Europe and the liberal tradition are coming apart at the seams. But not because, as they strongly imply, European politicians are pandering to the basest instincts of a mindless rabble – the ordinary people they have so little faith in. Rather, it is because a long experiment in liberalism has finally run its course. Liberalism has patently failed – and failed catastrophically.
These intellectuals are standing, like the rest of us, on a precipice from which we are about to jump or topple. But the abyss has not opened up, as they suppose, because liberalism is being rejected. Rather, the abyss is the inevitable outcome of this shrinking elite’s continuing promotion – against all rational evidence – of liberalism as a solution to our current predicament. It is the continuing transformation of a deeply flawed ideology into a religion. It is idol worship of a value system hellbent on destroying us.
Liberalism, like most ideologies, has an upside. Its respect for the individual and his freedoms, its interest in nurturing human creativity, and its promotion of universal values and human rights over tribal attachment have had some positive consequences.
But liberal ideology has been very effective at hiding its dark side – or more accurately, at persuading us that this dark side is the consequence of liberalism’s abandonment rather than inherent to the liberal’s political project.
The loss of traditional social bonds – tribal, sectarian, geographic – has left people today more lonely, more isolated than was true of any previous human society. We may pay lip service to universal values, but in our atomised communities, we feel adrift, abandoned and angry.
Humanitarian resource grabs
The liberal’s professed concern for others’ welfare and their rights has, in reality, provided cynical cover for a series of ever-more transparent resource grabs. The parading of liberalism’s humanitarian credentials has entitled our elites to leave a trail of carnage and wreckage in their wake in Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya, Syria and soon, it seems, in Venezuela. We have killed with our kindness and then stolen our victims’ inheritance.
Unfettered individual creativity may have fostered some great – if fetishised – art, as well as rapid mechanical and technological developments. But it has also encouraged unbridled competition in every sphere of life, whether beneficial to humankind or not, and however wasteful of resources.
At its worst, it has unleashed quite literally an arms race, one that – because of a mix of our unconstrained creativity, our godlessness and the economic logic of the military-industrial complex – culminated in the development of nuclear weapons. We have now devised the most complete and horrific ways imaginable to kill each other. We can commit genocide on a global scale.
Meanwhile, the absolute prioritising of the individual has sanctioned a pathological self-absorption, a selfishness that has provided fertile ground not only for capitalism, materialism and consumerism but for the fusing of all of them into a turbo-charged neoliberalism. That has entitled a tiny elite to amass and squirrel away most of the planet’s wealth out of reach of the rest of humanity.
Worst of all, our rampant creativity, our self-regard and our competitiveness have blinded us to all things bigger and smaller than ourselves. We lack an emotional and spiritual connection to our planet, to other animals, to future generations, to the chaotic harmony of our universe. What we cannot understand or control, we ignore or mock.
And so the liberal impulse has driven us to the brink of extinguishing our species and possibly all life on our planet. Our drive to asset-strip, to hoard resources for personal gain, to plunder nature’s riches without respect to the consequences is so overwhelming, so compulsive that the planet will have to find a way to rebalance itself. And if we carry on, that new balance – what we limply term “climate change” – will necessitate that we are stripped from the planet.
Nadir of a dangerous arrogance
One can plausibly argue that humans have been on this suicidal path for some time. Competition, creativity, selfishness predate liberalism, after all. But liberalism removed the last restraints, it crushed any opposing sentiment as irrational, as uncivilised, as primitive.
Liberalism isn’t the cause of our predicament. It is the nadir of a dangerous arrogance we as a species have been indulging for too long, where the individual’s good trumps any collective good, defined in the widest possible sense.
The liberal reveres his small, partial field of knowledge and expertise, eclipsing ancient and future wisdoms, those rooted in natural cycles, the seasons and a wonder at the ineffable and unknowable. The liberal’s relentless and exclusive focus is on “progress”, growth, accumulation.
What is needed to save us is radical change. Not tinkering, not reform, but an entirely new vision that removes the individual and his personal gratification from the centre of our social organisation.
This is impossible to contemplate for the elites who think more liberalism, not less, is the solution. Anyone departing from their prescriptions, anyone who aspires to be more than a technocrat correcting minor defects in the status quo, is presented as a menace. Despite the modesty of their proposals, Jeremy Corbyn in the UK and Bernie Sanders in the US have been reviled by a media, political and intellectual elite heavily invested in blindly pursuing the path to self-destruction.
Status-quo cheerleaders
As a result, we now have three clear political trends.
The first is the status-quo cheerleaders like the European writers of liberalism’s latest – last? – manifesto. With every utterance they prove how irrelevant they have become, how incapable they are of supplying answers to the question of where we must head next. They adamantly refuse both to look inwards to see where liberalism went wrong and to look outwards to consider how we might extricate ourselves.
Irresponsibly, these guardians of the status quo lump together the second and third trends in the futile hope of preserving their grip on power. Both trends are derided indiscriminately as “populism”, as the politics of envy, the politics of the mob. These two fundamentally opposed, alternative trends are treated as indistinguishable.
This will not save liberalism, but it will assist in promoting the much worse of the two alternatives.
Those among the elites who understand that liberalism has had its day are exploiting the old ideology of grab-it-for-yourself capitalism while deflecting attention from their greed and the maintenance of their privilege by sowing discord and insinuating dark threats.
The criticisms of the liberal elite made by the ethnic nationalists sound persuasive because they are rooted in truths about liberalism’s failure. But as critics, they are disingenuous. They have no solutions apart from their own personal advancement in the existing, failed, self-sabotaging system.
The new authoritarians are reverting to old, trusted models of xenophobic nationalism, scapegoating others to shore up their own power. They are ditching the ostentatious, conscience-salving sensitivities of the liberal so that they can continue plundering with heady abandon. If the ship is going down, then they will be gorging on the buffet till the waters reach the dining-hall ceiling.
Where hope can reside
The third trend is the only place where hope can reside. This trend – what I have previously ascribed to a group I call the “dissenters” – understands that radical new thinking is required. But given that this group is being actively crushed by the old liberal elite and the new authoritarians, it has little public and political space to explore its ideas, to experiment, to collaborate, as it urgently needs to.
Social media provides a potentially vital platform to begin critiquing the old, failed system, to raise awareness of what has gone wrong, to contemplate and share radical new ideas, and to mobilise. But the liberals and authoritarians understand this as a threat to their own privilege. Under a confected hysteria about “fake news”, they are rapidly working to snuff out even this small space.
We have so little time, but still the old guard wants to block any possible path to salvation – even as seas filled with plastic start to rise, as insect populations disappear across the globe, and as the planet prepares to cough us out like a lump of infected mucus.
We must not be hoodwinked by these posturing, manifesto-spouting liberals: the philosophers, historians and writers – the public relations wing – of our suicidal status quo. They did not warn us of the beast lying cradled in our midst. They failed to see the danger looming, and their narcissism blinds them still.
We should have no use for the guardians of the old, those who held our hands, who shone a light along a path that has led to the brink of our own extinction. We need to discard them, to close our ears to their siren song.
There are small voices struggling to be heard above the roar of the dying liberal elites and the trumpeting of the new authoritarians. They need to be listened to, to be helped to share and collaborate, to offer us their visions of a different world. One where the individual is no longer king. Where we learn some modesty and humility – and how to love in our infinitely small corner of the universe.
No one pays me to write these blog posts. If you appreciated it, or any of the others, please consider hitting the donate button in the right-hand margin (computer) or below (phone).

capitalism, environment, Europe, Left politics


https://www.jonathan-cook.net/blog/2019-01-27/a-liberal-elite-still-pushing-us-towards-the-abyss/
 

chomper

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#2
They are just trying to protect their seat on the gravy train...
 

Alton

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#3
Today's liberals are NOTHING like original historical liberals. Would you be shocked if I told you that most people active on this board would qualify as genuine, original, historically based political liberals? Such liberals would today be called something closer to "extreme libertarians". Today's republicans would be looked down upon as "statist federalists" seeking to increase the power of government to rule and destroy following in the very same path, albeit at a much slower pace, that today's democrats trod long ago and look where they are today...globalist, socialist, communists.

Gravy train? No. It's time to set aside that old worn out and NEVER true notion that it's somehow all about the money. Money is nothing but the tool of power. The real prize is now and has always been POWER. With power money just automatically comes...ask ANY Rothschild. Money follows power. Yet few understand this...
 

chomper

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#4
Today's liberals are NOTHING like original historical liberals. Would you be shocked if I told you that most people active on this board would qualify as genuine, original, historically based political liberals? Such liberals would today be called something closer to "extreme libertarians". Today's republicans would be looked down upon as "statist federalists" seeking to increase the power of government to rule and destroy following in the very same path, albeit at a much slower pace, that today's democrats trod long ago and look where they are today...globalist, socialist, communists.

Gravy train? No. It's time to set aside that old worn out and NEVER true notion that it's somehow all about the money. Money is nothing but the tool of power. The real prize is now and has always been POWER. With power money just automatically comes...ask ANY Rothschild. Money follows power. Yet few understand this...
I don't disagree with your post at all, however these muppets that are bleating the loudest are addicted to the teat of the EU. So in this instance, yes it is about money, deluded they may be.
 

Alton

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I don't disagree with your post at all, however these muppets that are bleating the loudest are addicted to the teat of the EU. So in this instance, yes it is about money, deluded they may be.
As you called it, "muppets...addicted to the teat of the EU" These are mere "bit players" and NOT the power centers. Who cobbled up the middle east? Who subjugated Asia Minor? What empire has ever conquered Afghanistan where both power AND money ever and always fails? Yet what is done in Afghanistan always manages to feed the demands of said empires. Afghanistan always manages to play it's role in the power schemes of the world much like Turkey and India and even China. These countries and many more always serve the real power in the world and money is the tool that makes that happen for those in power.
 

Libertaurum

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#6
Today's liberals are NOTHING like original historical liberals. Would you be shocked if I told you that most people active on this board would qualify as genuine, original, historically based political liberals? Such liberals would today be called something closer to "extreme libertarians".
...
Thank you. I refuse to refer to socialists as "liberals".

It is no coincidence that socialists have fooled liberty lovers into condeming liberalism. They subverted the definition of "liberal" to undermine people's ability to recognize socialism and differentiate it from liberalism.

Confound and confuse.

And many actual liberals participate in perpetuating this confusion by accepting and adopting socialist definitions in their own language.

Liberalism is the opposite of socialism.

Liberalism was what conservatives were supposed to conserve.
 

BarnacleBob

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#7
Today's liberals are NOTHING like original historical liberals. Would you be shocked if I told you that most people active on this board would qualify as genuine, original, historically based political liberals? Such liberals would today be called something closer to "extreme libertarians". Today's republicans would be looked down upon as "statist federalists" seeking to increase the power of government to rule and destroy following in the very same path, albeit at a much slower pace, that today's democrats trod long ago and look where they are today...globalist, socialist, communists.

Gravy train? No. It's time to set aside that old worn out and NEVER true notion that it's somehow all about the money. Money is nothing but the tool of power. The real prize is now and has always been POWER. With power money just automatically comes...ask ANY Rothschild. Money follows power. Yet few understand this...
This is a review of the period prior to western civilization initiating a reorganization... The status quo are trying to prevent the reorganization... if the civilization fails to reorganize, then it will follow the past of all other civilizations and implode just like the USSR, Rome, Egypt & Akka, etc...

Western civ has reached this apex 3 previous times, always reorganizing & creating greater periods of prosperity post each reorganization period. It all hinges on whether the Anglo-American empire IS the "universal empire." If it is, the A-A will prevent reorganization & the civilization will fracture & collapse piecemeal into a Frankenstein monster.... the process is well underway, yet the future has not been wholey decided. At this point it historically can go either way... I suspect technology will most likely crush the aging congested status quo by devaluing their assets & powers, and a new period of prosperity emerges.... Its the entrenched status quo that seek to roll back technology to protect their obsolete & devaluing assets. This is axiomatic considering the fiat injections post the 2007 - 2009 GFC... the Central Banks saved the status quos asses as their old worn out collateralized assets are devaluing & becoming obsolete. Todays technology is challenging the olde gaurd as their outdated institutions lose credibility & usefulness in the new age.
 

arminius

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#8
At this point it historically can go either way... I suspect technology will most likely crush the aging congested status quo by devaluing their assets & powers, and a new period of prosperity emerges....

Todays technology is challenging the olde gaurd as their outdated institutions lose credibility & usefulness in the new age.
We can only hope, but yeah, it's possible...

But the old guard want this socialist change, as it's increased control for them, so while this advent change BB reports is possible, likely it might be utter hell to get there as they'll be fighting tooth and nail to keep control, and that's when they start large wars, as the supreme distraction...
 

Scorpio

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the point BB brings up is up and down the whole economy,

you see it as all you old @#$ here retire, or ease into it,

that well earned wisdom and experience is gone,

those that come behind are left to their own vices,

the faceplants, goog, etc all run by snot nosed libtards. You have deeply imbedded major corps within the economy switching over. You have rino repubs who no more resemble a conservative than FDR himself.

we spoke to this about how big media and the like are all transitioning to marketing their trinkets of one type or another to the newer model generations. All these little social justice warriors are playing off the current snowflake sentiment.

they truly do believe they have a better idea, that it takes a village and all that jazz.

yet, they are too stupid to realize how very elegant our original founders intent was for all people.

that our founders warned us of these very issues and problems arising into the future.

and of course, you can only write a road map with the information at hand at the time it is created.

many here are aging on, and we have to leave it to the younger crowds to figure it out, or sink accordingly.

there is no way out when the very principles of the sides are so far apart

even my battle lines have been drawn tight, as years ago the mention of a libtard would be yeah whatever,
but now? Now it is libtard? Hang his ass.

I cannot even accept anything they have to say for they are so diametrically opposite of what I choose to believe.

At this point, I just want them all to leave me alone, to quit saturating my existence with their evil and demonic ways.

The really sad part is, it appears to me that many of these propaganda tools actually believe the tripe they spew forth, whether cortez or that little smirking punk from FL.
 

BarnacleBob

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Socialism is the nasty infection brought on by State sponsored usury.
Socialism is the cover & protection being employed to falsly protect the system & its institutions as it diminishes in power & authority... The system is in decline as it needs & requires reorganization, meaningful systemic institutional innovation, & reorganization. The 19th & 20th century ideas, concepts & organization no longer work to expand the marginal utility of the system, nay, the system is now providing REAL negative returns.... The system is rotten top to bottom and is totally unsustainable. We have entered the point of no return... the only question is how the reorganization will occur, either voluntarilly or by necessity... JMO
 

Alton

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#12
Socialism is the cover & protection being employed to falsly protect the system & its institutions as it diminishes in power & authority... The system is in decline as it needs & requires reorganization, meaningful systemic institutional innovation, & reorganization. The 19th & 20th century ideas, concepts & organization no longer work to expand the marginal utility of the system, nay, the system is now providing REAL negative returns.... The system is rotten top to bottom and is totally unsustainable. We have entered the point of no return... the only question is how the reorganization will occur, either voluntarilly or by necessity... JMO
And a good opinion it is.

Socialism is the palliative, the bromide, the AstroGlide to make it easier to slip in the prime ideology of communism and finally accomplish the full and complete apotheosis of government by the government and for the government. The concept of an independent and autonomous individual is fully discredited and eliminated. No rights for individuals or even subgroups of the collective whole as ALL will be refereed and determined by government alone.

In one form or another and by numerous names and definitions and for a myriad of real and false reasons this has ever and always been the goal of those agents of the one that owns this world. We really are, at this point in time, closer than humanity has ever been to the point of achieving this goal. Look at how deeply the democrat politicians are guided by this ideology. They have NEVER been phased by the falseness and incessant continual failure of this ideology or of it murderous and calamitous effects on ANY population under it's rule. This alone proves beyond the shadow of any doubt that these people who adopt and support this ideology are reprobate. Their brains, their mind has been seared with a hot iron. They are totally void of any just judgment. They are mentally defective. At worst they are, indeed, psychopaths hellbent on the destruction in total of this country and it's population. Furthermore, their success to this point has emboldened many more domestic and foreign persons to jump on their bandwagon and to adopt and act on their doctrine of destruction.

But, what if there is another outcome? One that no one expects or one that not even history could predict? What if the world is left in a shambles in the aftermath? Fractured and broken everywhere and it becomes a weird free-for-all to re-establish government and societies? What chaos wuld be unleashed? What of human near term past would be implemented to bring a form of order to the chaos? With secret and known technolgies I'm certain it would appear as some frightening and repulsive Sci-Fi novel unleashed on an ill-prepared world leaving only those who survive the shock to embrace this weird new world.

Seriously, I'm grasping for ideas and concepts that are rather foreign to me because as much as I wrestle with the ideas I am at a loss to see how humans would repeat any of our historical outcomes to previous collapses of the world. As much as I despise saying this, in terms of known and/or accepted human history, I really can't help but think that this time it will be much different.
 

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And a good opinion it is.

Socialism is the palliative, the bromide, the AstroGlide to make it easier to slip in the prime ideology of communism and finally accomplish the full and complete apotheosis of government by the government and for the government. The concept of an independent and autonomous individual is fully discredited and eliminated. No rights for individuals or even subgroups of the collective whole as ALL will be refereed and determined by government alone.

In one form or another and by numerous names and definitions and for a myriad of real and false reasons this has ever and always been the goal of those agents of the one that owns this world. We really are, at this point in time, closer than humanity has ever been to the point of achieving this goal. Look at how deeply the democrat politicians are guided by this ideology. They have NEVER been phased by the falseness and incessant continual failure of this ideology or of it murderous and calamitous effects on ANY population under it's rule. This alone proves beyond the shadow of any doubt that these people who adopt and support this ideology are reprobate. Their brains, their mind has been seared with a hot iron. They are totally void of any just judgment. They are mentally defective. At worst they are, indeed, psychopaths hellbent on the destruction in total of this country and it's population. Furthermore, their success to this point has emboldened many more domestic and foreign persons to jump on their bandwagon and to adopt and act on their doctrine of destruction.

But, what if there is another outcome? One that no one expects or one that not even history could predict? What if the world is left in a shambles in the aftermath? Fractured and broken everywhere and it becomes a weird free-for-all to re-establish government and societies? What chaos wuld be unleashed? What of human near term past would be implemented to bring a form of order to the chaos? With secret and known technolgies I'm certain it would appear as some frightening and repulsive Sci-Fi novel unleashed on an ill-prepared world leaving only those who survive the shock to embrace this weird new world.

Seriously, I'm grasping for ideas and concepts that are rather foreign to me because as much as I wrestle with the ideas I am at a loss to see how humans would repeat any of our historical outcomes to previous collapses of the world. As much as I despise saying this, in terms of known and/or accepted human history, I really can't help but think that this time it will be much different.
When the commie ideology becomes univerasal worldwide, the world will fail and enter a new "dark" age, civilization will rebuild and a new age of prosperity will emerge. This has been the cycle, and interestingly the time periods for the so called cyclical dark ages have been shortening with every cycle... hence "Out of the ashes, the Phoenix rises" over & over.
 

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#14
Socialism is the cover & protection being employed to falsly protect the system & its institutions as it diminishes in power & authority... The system is in decline as it needs & requires reorganization, meaningful systemic institutional innovation, & reorganization. The 19th & 20th century ideas, concepts & organization no longer work to expand the marginal utility of the system, nay, the system is now providing REAL negative returns.... The system is rotten top to bottom and is totally unsustainable. We have entered the point of no return... the only question is how the reorganization will occur, either voluntarilly or by necessity... JMO
I caught on to what the goobermint was doing by extending unemployment benefits. They sent our jobs out and needed to pacify the masses.
 

Scorpio

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to me, one must first assess if max extraction has been achieved before a empire of any type can collapse,

is the US in expansion mode, or is it in topping mode?
is the US capable of expanding the reach of its monetary control?

for instance, they have the world bank and the international bank of settlements.
we have heard how there are now competitors to these due to sanctions established by .gov here.

yet, are they really just carving out a section of the total market for themselves, which big picture is relatively minor?

facts are:
-all of south america has not been fully extracted
-russia has not been fully extracted
-africa certainly has the people, but do they have the turf and resources to accomplish a full extraction?
-this would also apply to india and pakistan, with india being much further down the path
-then there is Iran, Iraq, n korea, vietnam, ex sov satellite countries, all partially extracted from

which then begs the question, if that capacity is out there, can the transformation be achieved to accomplish it?

Can we get Vene and Brazil on board with the giving up their resources and purchasing tp and trinkets from the world market?

Can we continue to move the ex sov satellites toward a consumption economy?

If the answer is yes, then it is quite possible that this fiat train can continue long into the future, provided the proper debt fuel.

Whereas if you think we are topping out, and debt saturation is nearing its maximum potential, then the end of this particular fiefdom is closer than many would argue.

Before you answer, it might be wise to consider that this was achieved with Japan and China. It took 30 yrs for Japan to get really rolling, and the same for the chins.

In return though, we gave up huge components of our local economy to pull it off. We allowed Japan unfettered access to our markets while they were blocking their local markets from us. Same with the chins.

Leading to a interesting wrinkle, in that is it possible to pit one against the other? For instance, we have already given up the appliance market here in total. Can competitors be created in south america that are direct competitors of the asians, while still maintaining a harmonious balance between them? Wherein sa would be allowed to make down market items while the asians move up market?

These are the type of questions one must ask if you are trying to determine the fate of the current illusory empire.

I think most agree here the US is not the empire, maybe the face of it, but not the whole of it.

BB and I have been surmising that politicians at all levels are nothing but tools, with no real power to do anything. They are the facade, but certainly not the control.

this could go on for awhile, so I'll cut it and stfu
 

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#17
The facade, or the matrix by another name. Yes, you are correct, it has gone on for a long time and can continue - a global Tytler cycle.

I'm not betting on collapse, slow road to serfdom, probably yes, but "collapse" is an individual thing. The "collapse" will be identified by historians, if there's any left following the serfdom stage.
 

Libertaurum

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#18
In Oz the "Liberals" are the right side of our political spectrum.

If you do the whole right left thing.

Which confuses me if Nazis are supposed to be far right.
Right and left, up and down... Doesn't really make much sense.
To me you are either an individualist or some kind of collectivist. Simple as that.

Nazis were called far right because they were nationalists and anti-semites. In fact, they were socialists, since they supported gov't control of the economy "for the common good". And that's what's so dangerous about nationalist-socialism. It tends to bring together pro-socialist people from the left with nationalists from the right.

Just imagine if Tramp went and adopted Bernie's economic platform along with his pink-nationalist rhetoric. Like it or not, he'd probably win.
Sheep would much rather have someone tell them that they will be taken care of than someone promise they'll be free. And that, really, is the crux of the problem.
 

southfork

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#19
We have already fallen into the abyss, there are more people in the US living off the sweat of others than actively employed , the dam has burst and will reach town soonl
 

FunnyMoney

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#20
We have already fallen into the abyss, there are more people in the US living off the sweat of others than actively employed , the dam has burst and will reach town soonl
Crony socialism is deeply intertwined into the system. Along with crony capitalism, the two of these have destroyed much of the American Dream and have stolen most of whatever wealth workers have been able to save over the decades.

While there are still some very prosperous people in our nation, things would be vastly different (less crime, more prosperity, less hours required to work to maintain SOL, less costly and better education, health care, transportation and the list goes on...) if it wasn't for the above situation.

TPTB use the socialism vs. capitalism and left vs. right debates to manage change. Any real solution (RP for example) will be completely ignored and will not be part of the debate.

At GIM1, consensus was that neither crony capitalism nor crony socialism would work out well for the average American and until the truth of our situation and the obfuscation of that truth by the media and politicians comes to the forefront of concern, nothing much will change.

Many members here believe the exact opposite - many, if not most, believe that DJT doing things in secret and holding secret meetings and playing 6-D chess will eventually solve all problems - if the detractors would just shut up.

Never once in the history of mankind has that strategy worked out and it won't this time either.

Things got worse under Nixon and then even worse under Carter. Reagan was shot and caved to the MIC and his ideas about honest economic policy remained at the hospital where he recovered from his wounds. Bush 1 was working for TPTB all along, as was his dad. Clinton was there to make a deal (Clinton didn't need to declare bankruptcy 7 times to get rich - he knew the art of the deal long before Trump and changed the American Dream into a gov't manipulated lottery - again, at the request of, you guessed it, TPTB.

Bush 2 was working for TPTB all along, as was his dad. Ditto for Obummer. Ditto for Tramp.
 

Scorpio

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#21
At GIM1, consensus was that neither crony capitalism nor crony socialism would work out well for the average American and until the truth of our situation and the obfuscation of that truth by the media and politicians comes to the forefront of concern, nothing much will change.
and we were correct then, as we are now IMO

people try to declare this area on the 3rd rock as 'a democracy' and 'a capitalist system'
which are both incorrect,

but I digress
 

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