• "Spreading the ideas of freedom loving people on matters regarding metals, finance, politics, government and many other topics"

are we starting to get the picture yet regarding crypts/privacy/the future?

Casey Jones

Train left the station...
Gold Chaser
Site Supporter ++
Platinum Bling
Joined
Apr 4, 2020
Messages
10,135
Reaction score
16,457
Location
Down the road from the Kaczynski ranch

Don’t Dismiss the Possibility of Gold Confiscation​

https://internationalman.com/articles/the-greatest-threat-to-gold-ownership/

If you hold precious metals in your portfolio, there is a good chance you fear hyperinflation and the crash of fiat currencies.

You probably distrust governments in general and believe they are self-serving and have no interest in your economic well-being. It is likely that your holdings in gold are your lifeline – your hope to get you through these times while holding on to your wealth.

But have you ever given any thought to the possibility of having this lifeline confiscated by the authorities?

In my conversations with friends and associates, I have often raised this question. The typical responses:

“They’d never do that.”

“I’ll deal with that if and when it happens.”

“I just wouldn’t give it to them.”

I consider these “wishful thinking” responses.

It’s an interesting thought that the greatest threat to gold and silver investment might not be the possibility of losing on the speculation, but the government taking it away from you. It’s a thought that I’ve found few want to even think about, let alone discuss.

If you fall into this camp, you’re in good company. Some of the forecasters whom I respect most highly also treat it either as unlikely or at best, “something we may need to look at in the future.” To date, in conversing with top advisors worldwide, the two primary reasons they believe gold will not be confiscated are:

  1. “Confiscation would mean the government acknowledges the reality of the value of gold.”
Yes, this is quite so. They would be changing their official view… which, of course, they do all the time. But I submit that all that they need to do is put the proper spin on it.
  1. “They would meet greater resistance than they did back in ’33.”
I expect that this is also true, but that a plan will be put in place to deal with that resistance.

We’ll address both of these assertions in more detail shortly, but first, a bit of history.

In 1933, Franklin Roosevelt came into office and immediately created the Emergency Banking Act, which demanded that all those who held gold (other than personal jewelry) turn it in to approved banks. Holders were given less than a month to do this. The government then paid them $20.67 per ounce – the going rate at the time. Following confiscation, the government declared that the new value of gold was $35.00. In essence, they arbitrarily increased the value of their newly purchased asset by 69%. (This alone is reason enough to confiscate.)

Today, the US government is in much worse shape than it was in 1933, and it has much more to lose. The US dollar is the default currency of the world, but it’s on the ropes, which means the US economic power over the rest of the world is on the ropes.

I think that readers will agree that they will do anything to keep from losing this all-important power.

The US government has essentially run out of options. At some point, the fiat currencies of the First World will collapse, and some other form of payment will be necessary. Yes, the IMF is hoping to create a new default currency, but that, too, is to be a fiat currency. If any country were to produce a gold-backed currency in sufficient supply, that currency would likely become the desired currency worldwide. Fractional backing would be expected.

As most readers will know, the Chinese, Indians, Russians, and others see the opportunity and are building up their gold reserves quickly and substantially. If these countries were to agree to introduce a new gold-backed currency, there can be little doubt that they would succeed in changing the balance of world trade.

That said, the US government is watching these countries just as we are, and they are aware of the threat of gold to them.

The US government ostensibly has approximately 8,200 tonnes of gold in Fort Knox, although this may well be partially or completely missing. Additionally, it ostensibly holds a further 5,000 tonnes of gold in the cellar of the New York Federal Reserve building. Again, there is no certainty that it is there. In general, the authorities don’t seem to like independent audits.

In fact, there are rumors that the above vaults are nearly or completely empty and that the above quoted figures exist only on paper rather than in physical form. While there is no way to know this for sure, it’s not out of the question.

Either way, if the US and the EU could come up with a large volume of gold quickly, they could issue a gold-backed currency themselves. It’s a simple equation: The more gold they have = the more backed notes they can produce = the more power they continue to hold. By seizing upon the private supply of their citizens, they would increase their holdings substantially in short order.

Either that or they could just give up their dominance of world trade and power… What would you guess their choice would be?

It is entirely possible that the US government (and very likely the EU) has already made a decision to confiscate. They may have carefully laid out the plan and have set implementation to coincide with a specific gold price.

So how would this unfold? Let’s imagine a fairly extreme scenario and ask ourselves if it could be pulled off effectively:

  • The evening news programs announce that the economic recovery is being hampered by wealthy private investors who, by hoarding gold, are skewing the value of the dollar and threatening the middle and poorer classes. The little man is being made to suffer while the rich get richer. A press campaign to equate gold ownership with greed ensues.

  • The government announces the Second Emergency Banking Act, advising the public that “the first EBA was instituted by FDR to solve this same problem during the Great Depression. This act was instrumental in helping the little man ‘recover.'” (As the average man on the street doesn’t know his history nor how wrong this statement is, he’ll believe it. Besides, the announcement has a “feel-good” message, and that’s all that matters.)

  • Possessors of gold, who make up a small minority of the population, would become pariahs. It won’t matter that the guy who owns two gold Maple Leafs is not exactly a greedy, rich man. No one will wish to be seen as resisting confiscation. Neither will they wish to go to prison for resisting, no matter how remote the possibility.

  • The US pays for the gold in US dollars, which are rapidly headed south. Yes, the Fed will need to print more fiat dollars in order to pay them off, but this suits their purpose, as it inflates the dollar even more. Those who have turned in their gold will do whatever they can to unload the US dollars as quickly as possible and will need to find another investment at a time when there are very few trustworthy investments other than gold. The stock market would likely rise, showing the public how the gold confiscation program is “working.”

  • One last scary possibility: The government demands that gold is turned in immediately and that settlement will occur following confiscation. After confiscation, it announces that, as there has been such a large number of cases of rich people ripping off the little man, processing them all could take months, possibly even a year or more. A further announcement states that some investors have made an unreasonable profit on the backs of the poor and that they should not be granted this profit. This profit must be returned to the people. (You can almost hear the cheers of the people.) Then it sets about making assessments. The bureaucrats find that most investors do not have formal, acceptable receipts for every coin in their possession. So if you paid $1,200 for a Krugerrand a couple of years ago, you get paid $1,200. If you bought it at $250 in 1999, you get paid $250. But if you have no receipt in an acceptable form, you get a “fair,” median payment, say, $500, regardless of when you bought it.

  • Appeals: Each investor will be allowed up to one year to appeal the decision of the Treasury as to what is owed him. Of course, the investor knows that the dollar is sinking rapidly and that he would be wise to shut up and take what he is being offered.

Again, this hypothetical scenario is an extreme one. The reader is left to consider just how likely or unlikely this scenario is and what that would mean to his wealth.

But bear this in mind: If the above scenario were to take place soon, the average citizen would have mixed feelings. They would be glad that the “evil rich” had been taken down a peg, but they would worry about the idea of the government taking things by force, because they might be next. It would therefore be in the government’s interests to implement confiscation only after the coming panic sets in – after the next crash in the market, after it becomes plain to the average citizen that this really is a depression and he really is in big trouble. Then he will be only too glad to see the “greedy rich” go down, and he won’t care about the details.

As terrible as the thought is, it seems unlikely to me that the government will not confiscate gold, as they have little to lose and so much to gain.

Those who own gold would prefer to think that this cannot happen, but they have quite a lot riding on that hope and precious little evidence to support it.

It is entirely possible that this scenario will not take place, just as it is possible that confiscation will not take place. The purpose of this article is to spark some serious discussion – both for and against the possibility.
Well, if they destroy their fiat currency, impose, at force of arms, their digital money that can be controlled minutely or turned off with no effort...and then destroy the value of gold through turning it into contraband...the government(s) has/have basically decreed that the subjects can have no wealth.

That has happened to classes of people - slaves (throughout all history, since Sumer); political prisoners and prisoners in many societies, who forfeit all they had owned.

You can hold bitcoin or not; but those who think it's a magic pass, are DELUDED. If the government can ban file-sharing and trading of illegal porn on the internet, they can EASILY ban the other.

We need to turn our attention to, what to do when our government turns vicious. What our options are. None of them involve changing into a different type of exchange - basically, free markets will have been outlawed.
 

TAEZZAR

LADY JUSTICE ISNT BLIND, SHES JUST AFRAID TO WATCH
Midas Member
Eagle
Survivor
GIM Hall Of Fame
Joined
Apr 2, 2010
Messages
25,660
Reaction score
54,854
Location
ORYGUN
Possessors of gold, who make up a small minority of the population, would become pariahs. It won’t matter that the guy who owns two gold Maple Leafs is not exactly a greedy, rich man. No one will wish to be seen as resisting confiscation. Neither will they wish to go to prison for resisting, no matter how remote the possibility.
Isn't the government just wonderful !
Thieving sons a bitches !!! :totally steamed::totally steamed::totally steamed:

edit:
When holding gold is criminal, only criminals will hold gold !:don't    know2::gracious:
 

Avalon

The most courageous act is to think for yourself
Midas Member
Sr Midas Sup +++
GIM Hall Of Fame
Joined
Mar 30, 2010
Messages
9,189
Reaction score
21,345
Location
NC

Don’t Dismiss the Possibility of Gold Confiscation​

https://internationalman.com/articles/the-greatest-threat-to-gold-ownership/

If you hold precious metals in your portfolio, there is a good chance you fear hyperinflation and the crash of fiat currencies.

You probably distrust governments in general and believe they are self-serving and have no interest in your economic well-being. It is likely that your holdings in gold are your lifeline – your hope to get you through these times while holding on to your wealth.

But have you ever given any thought to the possibility of having this lifeline confiscated by the authorities?

In my conversations with friends and associates, I have often raised this question. The typical responses:

“They’d never do that.”

“I’ll deal with that if and when it happens.”

“I just wouldn’t give it to them.”

I consider these “wishful thinking” responses.

It’s an interesting thought that the greatest threat to gold and silver investment might not be the possibility of losing on the speculation, but the government taking it away from you. It’s a thought that I’ve found few want to even think about, let alone discuss.

If you fall into this camp, you’re in good company. Some of the forecasters whom I respect most highly also treat it either as unlikely or at best, “something we may need to look at in the future.” To date, in conversing with top advisors worldwide, the two primary reasons they believe gold will not be confiscated are:

  1. “Confiscation would mean the government acknowledges the reality of the value of gold.”
Yes, this is quite so. They would be changing their official view… which, of course, they do all the time. But I submit that all that they need to do is put the proper spin on it.
  1. “They would meet greater resistance than they did back in ’33.”
I expect that this is also true, but that a plan will be put in place to deal with that resistance.

We’ll address both of these assertions in more detail shortly, but first, a bit of history.

In 1933, Franklin Roosevelt came into office and immediately created the Emergency Banking Act, which demanded that all those who held gold (other than personal jewelry) turn it in to approved banks. Holders were given less than a month to do this. The government then paid them $20.67 per ounce – the going rate at the time. Following confiscation, the government declared that the new value of gold was $35.00. In essence, they arbitrarily increased the value of their newly purchased asset by 69%. (This alone is reason enough to confiscate.)

Today, the US government is in much worse shape than it was in 1933, and it has much more to lose. The US dollar is the default currency of the world, but it’s on the ropes, which means the US economic power over the rest of the world is on the ropes.

I think that readers will agree that they will do anything to keep from losing this all-important power.

The US government has essentially run out of options. At some point, the fiat currencies of the First World will collapse, and some other form of payment will be necessary. Yes, the IMF is hoping to create a new default currency, but that, too, is to be a fiat currency. If any country were to produce a gold-backed currency in sufficient supply, that currency would likely become the desired currency worldwide. Fractional backing would be expected.

As most readers will know, the Chinese, Indians, Russians, and others see the opportunity and are building up their gold reserves quickly and substantially. If these countries were to agree to introduce a new gold-backed currency, there can be little doubt that they would succeed in changing the balance of world trade.

That said, the US government is watching these countries just as we are, and they are aware of the threat of gold to them.

The US government ostensibly has approximately 8,200 tonnes of gold in Fort Knox, although this may well be partially or completely missing. Additionally, it ostensibly holds a further 5,000 tonnes of gold in the cellar of the New York Federal Reserve building. Again, there is no certainty that it is there. In general, the authorities don’t seem to like independent audits.

In fact, there are rumors that the above vaults are nearly or completely empty and that the above quoted figures exist only on paper rather than in physical form. While there is no way to know this for sure, it’s not out of the question.

Either way, if the US and the EU could come up with a large volume of gold quickly, they could issue a gold-backed currency themselves. It’s a simple equation: The more gold they have = the more backed notes they can produce = the more power they continue to hold. By seizing upon the private supply of their citizens, they would increase their holdings substantially in short order.

Either that or they could just give up their dominance of world trade and power… What would you guess their choice would be?

It is entirely possible that the US government (and very likely the EU) has already made a decision to confiscate. They may have carefully laid out the plan and have set implementation to coincide with a specific gold price.

So how would this unfold? Let’s imagine a fairly extreme scenario and ask ourselves if it could be pulled off effectively:

  • The evening news programs announce that the economic recovery is being hampered by wealthy private investors who, by hoarding gold, are skewing the value of the dollar and threatening the middle and poorer classes. The little man is being made to suffer while the rich get richer. A press campaign to equate gold ownership with greed ensues.

  • The government announces the Second Emergency Banking Act, advising the public that “the first EBA was instituted by FDR to solve this same problem during the Great Depression. This act was instrumental in helping the little man ‘recover.'” (As the average man on the street doesn’t know his history nor how wrong this statement is, he’ll believe it. Besides, the announcement has a “feel-good” message, and that’s all that matters.)

  • Possessors of gold, who make up a small minority of the population, would become pariahs. It won’t matter that the guy who owns two gold Maple Leafs is not exactly a greedy, rich man. No one will wish to be seen as resisting confiscation. Neither will they wish to go to prison for resisting, no matter how remote the possibility.

  • The US pays for the gold in US dollars, which are rapidly headed south. Yes, the Fed will need to print more fiat dollars in order to pay them off, but this suits their purpose, as it inflates the dollar even more. Those who have turned in their gold will do whatever they can to unload the US dollars as quickly as possible and will need to find another investment at a time when there are very few trustworthy investments other than gold. The stock market would likely rise, showing the public how the gold confiscation program is “working.”

  • One last scary possibility: The government demands that gold is turned in immediately and that settlement will occur following confiscation. After confiscation, it announces that, as there has been such a large number of cases of rich people ripping off the little man, processing them all could take months, possibly even a year or more. A further announcement states that some investors have made an unreasonable profit on the backs of the poor and that they should not be granted this profit. This profit must be returned to the people. (You can almost hear the cheers of the people.) Then it sets about making assessments. The bureaucrats find that most investors do not have formal, acceptable receipts for every coin in their possession. So if you paid $1,200 for a Krugerrand a couple of years ago, you get paid $1,200. If you bought it at $250 in 1999, you get paid $250. But if you have no receipt in an acceptable form, you get a “fair,” median payment, say, $500, regardless of when you bought it.

  • Appeals: Each investor will be allowed up to one year to appeal the decision of the Treasury as to what is owed him. Of course, the investor knows that the dollar is sinking rapidly and that he would be wise to shut up and take what he is being offered.

Again, this hypothetical scenario is an extreme one. The reader is left to consider just how likely or unlikely this scenario is and what that would mean to his wealth.

But bear this in mind: If the above scenario were to take place soon, the average citizen would have mixed feelings. They would be glad that the “evil rich” had been taken down a peg, but they would worry about the idea of the government taking things by force, because they might be next. It would therefore be in the government’s interests to implement confiscation only after the coming panic sets in – after the next crash in the market, after it becomes plain to the average citizen that this really is a depression and he really is in big trouble. Then he will be only too glad to see the “greedy rich” go down, and he won’t care about the details.

As terrible as the thought is, it seems unlikely to me that the government will not confiscate gold, as they have little to lose and so much to gain.

Those who own gold would prefer to think that this cannot happen, but they have quite a lot riding on that hope and precious little evidence to support it.

It is entirely possible that this scenario will not take place, just as it is possible that confiscation will not take place. The purpose of this article is to spark some serious discussion – both for and against the possibility.
nothing would surprise me :(
 

Casey Jones

Train left the station...
Gold Chaser
Site Supporter ++
Platinum Bling
Joined
Apr 4, 2020
Messages
10,135
Reaction score
16,457
Location
Down the road from the Kaczynski ranch
Well somebody has been shorting the ever loving $hit out of it so it must be on somebody's radar.
Silver is the money of the people. Gold, is the money of royalty; and debt the money of serfs; but of solvent, astute merchants/bourgeoisie, silver has been their money.

Sadly, the banksters, with their FED-ZIRP, have moar money than the middle-class...certainly more money than Wall Street Silver. So they are gonna BREAK it.
 

Lancers32

You know...the thing
Site Supporter ++
Platinum Bling
Joined
May 10, 2020
Messages
5,673
Reaction score
7,917
Location
NC
Everyone knows that national grocery store chains work on extremely low profit margins they depend upon volume to make it. How can they survive if the asset you accept for your goods is swinging wildly. Sorry I don't see it working until prices for crypto are stable.
 

spinalcracker

On a mail train.
Sr Midas Sup +++
Survivor
Platinum Bling
Joined
Apr 1, 2010
Messages
6,890
Reaction score
19,903
Location
On a mail train.
a basic overview of one of the changes El Salvador is trying to accomplish with Bitcoin




 

Scorpio

Разыскиваются украинские блондинки
Founding Member
Board Elder
GIM Hall Of Fame
Joined
Mar 25, 2010
Messages
34,477
Reaction score
57,585
yep,
he announced it with the whole move into crypt,
and he is betting an awful lot of cred doing so as the world laughs at him over it

what I read is he is actively pushing it, and moving it along
 

Lancers32

You know...the thing
Site Supporter ++
Platinum Bling
Joined
May 10, 2020
Messages
5,673
Reaction score
7,917
Location
NC
I have heard El Salvador will offer citizenship to those who bring their crypto with them.
 

Scorpio

Разыскиваются украинские блондинки
Founding Member
Board Elder
GIM Hall Of Fame
Joined
Mar 25, 2010
Messages
34,477
Reaction score
57,585
I wonder what that means?

As solarion and others have spoken of, you can transport your crypt without ever being online at all.
So you bring it with you, but under what conditions?

What is the catch?

Now sure, once you remove some from a private wallet and put it into the economy, then some is released into the system,
but can we assume those types of persons are NOT using their bitcoin as their day to day funding?
Where it is more a store of wealth in some fashion than it is currency?
 

Lancers32

You know...the thing
Site Supporter ++
Platinum Bling
Joined
May 10, 2020
Messages
5,673
Reaction score
7,917
Location
NC
I wonder what that means?

As solarion and others have spoken of, you can transport your crypt without ever being online at all.
So you bring it with you, but under what conditions?

What is the catch?

Now sure, once you remove some from a private wallet and put it into the economy, then some is released into the system,
but can we assume those types of persons are NOT using their bitcoin as their day to day funding?
Where it is more a store of wealth in some fashion than it is currency?


It only matters if you believe unfriendly governments will eventually go after your crypto holdings. They can take it and pay you whatever they want. If you are a citizen of a foreign country there are no taxes due the country you left. Gets complicated and you go down the rabbit hole. I don't think it matters unless you have a fortune in it but I would not have anything on the exchanges at this point. Even the CEO of Kraken came out and said as much in the past few days.
 

EO 11110

(LOIS LERNER) GOT AWAY WITH IT
Survivor
Site Supporter ++
Mother Lode
Joined
Jul 31, 2010
Messages
21,700
Reaction score
24,254
Location
clown world
crypto people are raysis. splc is on it


White supremacists embraced cryptocurrency early in its development, and in some cases produced million-dollar profits through the technology, reshaping the racist right in radical ways, a Hatewatch analysis found.

Hatewatch identified and compiled over 600 cryptocurrency addresses associated with white supremacists and other prominent far-right extremists for this essay and then probed their transaction histories through blockchain analysis software.

What we found is striking: White supremacists such as Greg Johnson of Counter-Currents, race pseudoscience pundit Stefan Molyneux, Andrew “Weev” Auernheimer and Andrew Anglin of the Daily Stormer, and Don Black of the racist forum Stormfront, all bought into Bitcoin early in its history and turned a substantial profit from it.

The estimated tens of millions of dollars’ worth of value extreme far-right figures generated represents a sum that would almost certainly be unavailable to them without cryptocurrency, and it gave them a chance to live comfortable lives while promoting hate and authoritarianism.
Extremist Early Adopters of Bitcoin

Updated: List of cryptocurrency addresses used by extremists
Less than a quarter of Americans presently own some form of cryptocurrency as of May 2021. But those numbers increase substantially within fringe right-wing spaces, according to Hatewatch’s findings, approaching something much closer to universal adoption. Hatewatch struggled to find any prominent player in the global far right who hasn’t yet embraced cryptocurrency to at least some degree. The average age of a cryptocurrency investor is 38, but even senior citizens in the white supremacist movement, such as Jared Taylor of American Renaissance, 69, and Peter Brimelow of VDARE, 73, have moved tens of thousands of dollars of the asset in recent years.

rest of story at link...
 

Goldhedge

Retired
Sr Midas Sup +++
Survivor
GIM Hall Of Fame
Joined
Mar 28, 2010
Messages
69,569
Reaction score
153,917
Location
Rocky Mountains
Something I hadn't considered...

programable cash.jpeg
 

Lancers32

You know...the thing
Site Supporter ++
Platinum Bling
Joined
May 10, 2020
Messages
5,673
Reaction score
7,917
Location
NC
So I guess we'll all be eating bugs and smoking lettuce. It's a tracker no it's a vaccine.
 

Avalon

The most courageous act is to think for yourself
Midas Member
Sr Midas Sup +++
GIM Hall Of Fame
Joined
Mar 30, 2010
Messages
9,189
Reaction score
21,345
Location
NC
I find this whole subject, a complete joke. 1's & 0's, in a cloud, selling for 1,000 times what gold sells for. Are these people nuts or desperate for a windfall. THERE IS NO VALUE IN 1'S & 0'S !!!
What next, are they going to be selling beach sand for $1,000 a grain ? At least you could "hold it" !:Grrr:
As bad as the fed is, at least you get a piece of paper with ink on it !
umm, our whole economy has been running on thin air for quite some time.
 

TAEZZAR

LADY JUSTICE ISNT BLIND, SHES JUST AFRAID TO WATCH
Midas Member
Eagle
Survivor
GIM Hall Of Fame
Joined
Apr 2, 2010
Messages
25,660
Reaction score
54,854
Location
ORYGUN

Avalon

The most courageous act is to think for yourself
Midas Member
Sr Midas Sup +++
GIM Hall Of Fame
Joined
Mar 30, 2010
Messages
9,189
Reaction score
21,345
Location
NC
Yes, but we are free to use our meager pittance, as we wish, after paying obligations.
I am against ANY form of digital $$$$. Yes, I know that our banking system has run for years on "ledger" entries, not actual $$$$$$. :Grrr:
Your preaching to the choir lol. I think digital money is part 2 of the freak show
 

SongSungAU

Mother Lode Found
Sr Site Supporter
Mother Lode
Joined
Jun 8, 2010
Messages
13,796
Reaction score
30,501
Sidebar with Mark Moss - Bitcoin & Beyond! Viva & Barnes LIVE! (1 hour)


Streamed live 15 hours ago on 2/23/2022 by Viva Fre​
 

Lancers32

You know...the thing
Site Supporter ++
Platinum Bling
Joined
May 10, 2020
Messages
5,673
Reaction score
7,917
Location
NC
Bitcoin still above the recent 33K bottom but if you think it is a safe haven think again.
 

Lancers32

You know...the thing
Site Supporter ++
Platinum Bling
Joined
May 10, 2020
Messages
5,673
Reaction score
7,917
Location
NC
They won't need a quantum computer to track crypto. Enables them to see every transaction from inception.