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El Salvador becomes the first country to approve Bitcoin as legal currency

southfork

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El Salvador becomes the first country to approve Bitcoin as legal currency

Saqib Shah
Saqib Shah·Contributing Writer
Wed, June 9, 2021, 8:04 AM
El Salvador's President Nayib Bukele has made good on his promise to adopt Bitcoin as legal tender. Officials in the Central American country's congress voted to accept the cryptocurrency by a majority of 62 out of 84 votes, reports CNBC. In a worldwide first, El Salvador will accept Bitcoin as legal tender alongside the US dollar in 90 days, according to the BBC. The law effectively means the cryptocurrency can be used as payment for goods or services unless a business cannot provide the tech required to facilitate the transaction.

The #BitcoinLaw has been approved by a supermajority in the Salvadoran Congress.

62 out of 84 votes!

History! #Btc
 

ds_mustang

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Several other South/Central American countries have made statements they will follow suit. I suspect this could be bigger than it seems. Bitcoin (and perhaps other crypto in the future) will become held as reserve assets by these countries. Businesses in El Salvador must accept Bitcoin as payment, and their banks will open up to bitcoin. As a side effect, it will attract crypto entrepreneurs who want a residence that doesn't tax crypto and where banks are crypto friendly. It's quite likely El Salvador will become significantly wealthier as a result of this action for a variety of reasons, not the least of which is they'll be using a sound money that is increasing in value rather than falling.

This is where the fight between the legacy fiat/banking system and crypto will probably heat up. Expect larger countries to start hassling the small countries using crypto as enabling terrorism, money laundering, etc.
 
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Buck

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i just moved a bit down there....


sarc

:summer:

they say 'it has to start somewhere', so, why not El Salvador?

and what happens to those merchants who don't have access to electricity in their hovel and some customer demands to buy their goat-milk-ice-cream for BC?

legal tender should mean not refused . . .

but i've already been into several 'stores', here in the Motherland, where cash is not accepted so, i'll just expect El Salvador will be the one to 'get this game going'

GL
 

ds_mustang

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The speed of what's going on in crypto has been fast and it will start to move even faster now. Growth has been exponential moving from being used by hobbyists, to small businesses, to big companies and hedge funds, and now to countries--in a decade. It's been the fastest growing tech in history. And it's only just begun. Most people haven't discovered other cryptos offer interest returns, lending/borrowing, free market exchanges, and other financial system features built right in. It's reaching a level where banking is about to be significantly disrupted. The first places to adopt will be the countries with large unbanked populations like El Salvador.
 
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dacrunch

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I guess that they "comprendo" Bitcoin better than me, lol !!!
 

ds_mustang

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I guess that they "comprendo" Bitcoin better than me, lol !!!
You probably have access to banking. Something like 70% of the population in El Salvador doesn't. So being able to get basic banking functions through crypto is a big deal to them. A lot of the economy is already using bitcoin as there is significant use of the crypto from people sending money to family members there from other countries.
 

Buck

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how is their power grid down there? they're going to have to ramp it up to get transaction times down to 5 minutes or less...
 

ds_mustang

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how is their power grid down there? they're going to have to ramp it up to get transaction times down to 5 minutes or less...
Transactions are validated by nodes running all across the world, not just there. And bitcoin block time is roughly 10 minutes anyway.
 

Buck

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Transactions are validated by nodes running all across the world, not just there. And bitcoin block time is roughly 10 minutes anyway.
so, i buy my goat-milk-ice-cream and will have that sucker finished by the time that transaction is denied due to some glitch...then what?

am i supposed to just ignore the fact i owe that vendor something?

i've got no cash, there's no need to have any, because I'm using BC for money...should the merchant call the cops?
 

ds_mustang

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so, i buy my goat-milk-ice-cream and will have that sucker finished by the time that transaction is denied due to some glitch...then what?

am i supposed to just ignore the fact i owe that vendor something?

i've got no cash, there's no need to have any, because I'm using BC for money...should the merchant call the cops?
From what I understand they've been using it for a while now. I doubt they're using it for ice cream or any small purchases as fees are too high for that. It's probably more likely being used as a savings account and for big purchases that need to be secure and irreversible. It also opens them to a world of global payments. Most people there don't have access to banks or brokers... You joke about it, but it's life changing technology to them.
 
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Buck

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a couple of things...

You joke about it, but it's life changing technology to them.
'life changing' is so nebulous...

what the Real Problem is: .gov

and honestly, it's not going to be a joke...it's a profit machine: Money Changers 2.0
I doubt they're using it for ice cream or any small purchases as fees are too high for that.
it doesn't cost me, on the immediate transaction, to use cash
it doesn't cost me, on the immediate transaction, to use a CC

so, that 1.00 goat milk ice cream just went to 1.50, at the point of sale, because i'm using BC to buy it...and those El Salvadorans, anyone for that matter, will continue to use BC and be happy to pay those transaction fees?

it's like their BC just took a 50% (pick a percentage) dip in value...
 

ds_mustang

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a couple of things...


'life changing' is so nebulous...

what the Real Problem is: .gov

and honestly, it's not going to be a joke...it's a profit machine: Money Changers 2.0

it doesn't cost me, on the immediate transaction, to use cash
it doesn't cost me, on the immediate transaction, to use a CC

so, that 1.00 goat milk ice cream just went to 1.50, at the point of sale, because i'm using BC to buy it...and those El Salvadorans, anyone for that matter, will continue to use BC and be happy to pay those transaction fees?

it's like their BC just took a 50% (pick a percentage) dip in value...
I just explained to you that they probably don't use bitcoin to make small purchases due to the fees. But to send larger amounts of money, bitcoin is much easier, faster, and cheaper than Western Union or similar services that used to dominate unbanked countries. It also costs no fees to save money with bitcoin and let it grow (especially for people with no access to savings accounts, stocks, etc). Also there are cryptos with faster transactions and low fees they can use if they choose.

As for the volatility, that's nothing new. Clearly they find crypto useful despite the volatility. Maybe they understand that when something goes up 500%, it will tend to fall 50% later.
 

Buck

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uh huh

tell you what...send your cash here, i've got no problems holding it for you

i'll simply make my vig when you use any of it...and i'll have figured out how to make enough to turn a profit and you'll just ignore that like those CC fees and monetary inflation costs......

people don't do things for free



i'm done here, i've read the tales, they just keep going on and on until they become circular...i'm only here for the tid-bits, not to enrage or to inflame

if there's profit to be made, make it, but i'll never see you waiting for me, at the checkout, while i wait for my BC transaction to conclude, a transaction that just added 10% to my total receipt

ain't gonna happen for me

:summer:
 

ds_mustang

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uh huh

tell you what...send your cash here, i've got no problems holding it for you

i'll simply make my vig when you use any of it...and i'll have figured out how to make enough to turn a profit and you'll just ignore that like those CC fees and monetary inflation costs......

people don't do things for free



i'm done here, i've read the tales, they just keep going on and on until they become circular...i'm only here for the tid-bits, not to enrage or to inflame

if there's profit to be made, make it, but i'll never see you waiting for me, at the checkout, while i wait for my BC transaction to conclude, a transaction that just added 10% to my total receipt

ain't gonna happen for me

:summer:
Why do you come into every discussion about crypto when you clearly aren't interested? I seems you are interested somehow, at least to complain about it. Lol
 

Goldhedge

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Looks like we'll be starting a war in El Salvado pretty soon....
 

Buck

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Why do you come into every discussion about crypto when you clearly aren't interested? I seems you are interested somehow, at least to complain about it. Lol
good question:
i originally focused on how circular your logic, not just yours, but others, are regarding crypto's

it's a normalcy bias type of a thing...i was just practicing my verbiage by discussing any of this as it can't be discussed when one side is chasing greed

it's like trying to take away candy from a baby then telling it candy is bad for their teeth...all i hear back is "I've got no teeth yet you bum"


the only response is:
O.K. here's your candy back


but it's all in fun you see...it's not my risk, not my money but certainly my opinion
 

Scorpio

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Buck,

could you not look at apple pay and others like it here and see that it really isn't that different? (yes yes, far different but big pic not really)

people using 'bill pay' with their bank account, or using venmo to send dough to others?

now sure, you may not be using any of this modern tinkery, but many many are, and it has become 2nd nature for them,

as ds stated, one of the limiting factors is the transactional costs, and they are cumbersome currently
far too much so to be a day to day vehicle

Venezuela has completely blown up their banking and fiat system, Argentina ?, seems to default every few years or so, leaving the slaves without a solid currency and banking system. What about Africa?

Etc.
 

Uncle

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No BTC or cash required, Bear Dude.

The six hundred and sixty six thing is already prowling.

Mobile money is a technology that allows people to receive, store and spend money using a mobile phone. It’s sometimes referred to as a 'mobile wallet' or by the name of a specific service such as mPesa, EcoCash, GCash, Tigo Pesa and many more. There are more than 270 different mobile money services around the world, although they are most popular in Africa, Asia and Latin America. Mobile money is a popular alternative to both cash and banks because it’s easy to use, secure and can used anywhere there is a mobile phone signal.

https://www.worldremit.com/en/mobile-money

https://www.forbes.com/sites/ilonalimonta-volkova/2020/12/07/mobile-money-in-africa/

Golden Regards
Uncle
 

specsaregood

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Transactions are validated by nodes running all across the world, not just there. And bitcoin block time is roughly 10 minutes anyway.
Unless something has changed, when I was working on enabling bitcoin payments in my software the processors recommended a minimum of 3 validations before considering a transaction "safe", approx 30 minutes.

But regardless, 10minutes is still a lifetime when talking about handling most daily transactions. you expect people to wait that long to pay?
 

the_shootist

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Unless something has changed, when I was working on enabling bitcoin payments in my software the processors recommended a minimum of 3 validations before considering a transaction "safe", approx 30 minutes.

But regardless, 10minutes is still a lifetime when talking about handling most daily transactions. you expect people to wait that long to pay?
When I pay for PMs by echeck I still need to wait 5 days for it to clear before my order can be shipped
 

specsaregood

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and what happens to those merchants who don't have access to electricity in their hovel and some customer demands to buy their goat-milk-ice-cream for BC?

The answer to your question is right there in the OP:
The law effectively means the cryptocurrency can be used as payment for goods or services unless a business cannot provide the tech required to facilitate the transaction.
 

specsaregood

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engineear

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Judging from the past we should be sending troops there soon...gottsta use the dollar or else! Remember Libya,
Viva la Colonel! Thanks Hilary, who said..,"we came, we saw, we killed him"...something like that.

Wait, this just in...."along side the dollar"...after his wife told him about Kadaffi, khadoffi, madcoffee, Madoffi...Madoff

She likes living in the palace.
 

ds_mustang

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Unless something has changed, when I was working on enabling bitcoin payments in my software the processors recommended a minimum of 3 validations before considering a transaction "safe", approx 30 minutes.

But regardless, 10minutes is still a lifetime when talking about handling most daily transactions. you expect people to wait that long to pay?
6 blocks is the recommendation for fully confirmed, which is an hour. However there is a lot of flexibility and it's really up to the receiver to determine risk vs wait time. If you trust the sender you don't need to wait at all. For a small, low-risk transaction you can consider the transaction done as soon as the transaction is seen by the network, which is usually immediately. For a larger transaction with some risk to it you might want to wait the 10 minutes for a block to make sure it gets into the blockchain. For an even higher risk transaction, or for transactions where time isn't an issue, you might want to wait 3-6 blocks like your processors recommended. It's completely up to the receiver how long they want to wait before they feel comfortable.

Comparing against credit cards and the US banking system, bitcoin transactions have significant advantages. Bank transactions take DAYS to settle. And practically speaking they never settle, especially credit card transactions, because there are various ways transactions can be reversed or funds frozen. With bitcoin there are no reversals and funds can't be frozen nor transactions prevented.

Besides, we're talking about mostly unbanked people who don't have the choices we take for granted for transacting online or globally.
 
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Buck

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The answer to your question is right there in the OP:
in a country like El Salvador, that must encompass a lot of the outlying business' then

exemption permission slips should be flying out the door and that makes me wonder if they're going to charge for that exemption...
 

specsaregood

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Comparing against credit cards and the US banking system, bitcoin transactions have significant advantages. Bank transactions take DAYS to settle. And practically speaking they never settle, especially credit card transactions, because there are various ways transactions can be reversed or funds frozen. With bitcoin there are no reversals and funds can't be frozen nor transactions prevented.

yes in comparison to credit cards, using bitcoin is a huge advantage to the vendor, but an equivalent disadvantage to the buyer. It flips the relationship around.
 

Buck

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yes in comparison to credit cards, using bitcoin is a huge advantage to the vendor, but an equivalent disadvantage to the buyer. It flips the relationship around.
and that's quite a point in and of itself...the merchant keeps the added 5% price increases he's already calculated onto his merchandise, to cover the costs of CC purchases, a percentage that the cash people pay as well because it's built into his retail prices, but the BC people pay it PLUS the added vig attached to that BC transaction that they won't pay either with cash or CC

the merchants will love this, until the following day comes and all that 'unconverted BC' drops in value and the merchant just lost 15%...


that's no way to control a monetary asset
 

ds_mustang

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yes in comparison to credit cards, using bitcoin is a huge advantage to the vendor, but an equivalent disadvantage to the buyer. It flips the relationship around.
Yes, bitcoin users can't call up bitcoin customer service and ask to have a transaction refunded. However considering 70% of people in El Salvador are unbanked, that's not really the problem. The problem is they don't have access to credit cards and Bitcoin gives them an alternative.
 

Buck

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unbanked...i really don't understand why this is an issue?

un-banked...i don't use a bank and i'm worse off because....?

but having BC makes me more safe because i'm not actually banked, what would i be if i was into BC?

it's certainly not a bank so why is the word bank, as in unbanked, applaied? isn't the point to avoid banks in the first place...by putting my money into another bank?

that makes no sense
 

specsaregood

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the merchants will love this, until the following day comes and all that 'unconverted BC' drops in value and the merchant just lost 15%...
I've mentioned before the bitcoin payment processors I've integrated with all offer the option to immediately convert the bitcoin to cash in their account, you get to pick the currency even.
 

Buck

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I've mentioned before the bitcoin payment processors I've integrated with all offer the option to immediately convert the bitcoin to cash in their account, you get to pick the currency even.
right, but haven't you ever been in a hurry to, say, go to a party that night, so, you kinda cobble up the 'end of the day' receipts, you'll finish them in the morning?.......by then the drop is in, too late

that's a common stupid human trick: Why do today what can easily be done tomorrow

some people have achieved Expert Status with that trick
 

ds_mustang

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right, but haven't you ever been in a hurry to, say, go to a party that night, so, you kinda cobble up the 'end of the day' receipts, you'll finish them in the morning?.......by then the drop is in, too late

that's a common stupid human trick: Why do today what can easily be done tomorrow

some people have achieved Expert Status with that trick
Welcome to 2021 where businesses doing things like this are now automated.
 

Buck

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xx

Welcome to 2021 where businesses doing things like this are now automated.
LOL

:rotf::rotf:

sure it is


LOL



that's the sole reason i had that job...

like i said, it eventually gets circular with dribs and drabs...then personal...

not what i want to engage in


GL

:beer:
 

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I guess bitcoin will flop any day now…………..
 

Buck

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I guess bitcoin will flop any day now…………..
how weird, i'm the opposite:

i'm expecting $100k

but you're being sarcastic, aren't you

:winks2: