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Major construction project this summer -- advice welcome

ttazzman

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The I-Joist along the stairway will be set on a 2x6 bearing wall (not shown) over a 20x8 footing. Post from the LVL roof beam will be directly on this.
figured that.....just a tickler reminder in case it slipped thru......as spread out as that load will be probably dont even need the footing if base is good
 

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Here in America, the only permit I needed was for the septic. Having to build with all permits causes a logistical nightmare and casts a cloud of uncertainty on your projects.
Been meaning to ask how the cabin's going but knew you got a bit burned out so gave space...but yeah how's the cabin going? :D
 

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figured that.....just a tickler reminder in case it slipped thru......as spread out as that load will be probably dont even need the footing if base is good
Will run this past my foundation contractor.
 

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Slv,
If you can spare the extra cost I'm a big proponent of sound "proofing". Consider adding an airgap or extra layer of drywall or staggered stud walls etc.
 

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Slv,
If you can spare the extra cost I'm a big proponent of sound "proofing". Consider adding an airgap or extra layer of drywall or staggered stud walls etc.
I have thought about this. 2x6 wall with staggered 2x4 studs. Insulate one side. I will probably go this route on the interior walls especially since one will eventually be a bedroom adjacent to a living room.
 

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I have thought about this. 2x6 wall with staggered 2x4 studs. Insulate one side. I will probably go this route on the interior walls especially since one will eventually be a bedroom adjacent to a living room.
Also they make foam strips and or "caulking tubes" of sound transmission goopus that you can use between drywall and studs. Also only screw the perimeter etc. I may have posted on the old site about the lab I built for Unfors. Has to soundproof it from printing machines on the same wearhouse floor and coincidentally, applied a pallet of lead rolls onto the walls for the radiation calibration use. Learned a lot about sound on that job.
 

ttazzman

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Will run this past my foundation contractor.

what we did in commercial on lighter load situations was ....in order of load least to worst....1st just sit wall on slab done hundreds of time in retrofits and infills......2nd put rebars at 1'o/c midway in slab ~3' long sticks perpendicular to wall......3rd was thicken the slab under the wall with rebar perpendicular and longitudinal with the wall......4th reinforced footing under slab .......again just tossin out things to consider....obviously the worst load will be where the upper column stands and it will need to be tranfered down to concrete floor
 

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I have thought about this. 2x6 wall with staggered 2x4 studs. Insulate one side. I will probably go this route on the interior walls especially since one will eventually be a bedroom adjacent to a living room.
Bathroom walls are a good place too.
 

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Been meaning to ask how the cabin's going but knew you got a bit burned out so gave space...but yeah how's the cabin going? :D
It's been finished a couple years. I'm living in it.
 

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It is written, when planning the construction, work from the roof down.
 

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First blood has been drawn. Started with $73,000. Just spent $14,000 (BUT... I will get a rebate of $1,500 in the form of store credit!). Have $59,000 left to get this done.

* Permits not yet paid ($600)
* Remaining building materials (finishing) should be another $11,000-$16,000
* Excavation yet unknown (two RFQs outstanding)
* ICF basement will be $19,000
* HVAC (radiant floor) unknown... should have a quote on the system from Radiantec by next week
* Carpenter visited yesterday. I like him and hope his quote is reasonable. I could do it myself... if I have to.
* Electrician unknown (one RFQ outstanding, another said he would look at it if I couldn't find someone else)

I am finding that most contractors are so busy with tract home construction that they aren't even interested in quoting an owner-builder.
 
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Voodoo

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We have a 4ft frost wall requirement. It is worth going the extra depth for the space.

We have at least an 18-24" requirement here. I would think a footing would still save money over a full foundation but that may change up north. Do almost all new houses around include basements? Are there any new Shouse / Pole Building style houses going up in the area?
 

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Just talked to our county inspector and found out that I won't need an inspection on the radiant heat plumbing, and the big news... because it is my primary residence I am allowed to do my own electrical wiring. That will save a pile of money!
 

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We have at least an 18-24" requirement here. I would think a footing would still save money over a full foundation but that may change up north. Do almost all new houses around include basements? Are there any new Shouse / Pole Building style houses going up in the area?
We are starting to see more shouse construction. I know some of it is "off the record." They built a pole barn then quietly finished part of it as a living area (often with porch and front door facing away from the road).
 

Voodoo

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First blood has been drawn. Started with $73,000. Just spent $14,000 (BUT... I will get a rebate of $1,500 in the form of store credit!). Have $59,000 left to get this done.

* Permits not yet paid ($600)
* Remaining building materials (finishing) should be another $11,000-$16,000
* Excavation yet unknown (two RFQs outstanding)
* ICF basement will be $19,000
* HVAC (radiant floor) unknown... should have a quote on the system from Radiantec by next week
* Carpenter visited yesterday. I like him and hope his quote is reasonable. I could do it myself... if I have to.
* Electrician unknown (one RFQ outstanding, another said he would look at it if I couldn't find someone else)

I am finding that most contractors are so busy with tract home construction that they aren't even interested in quoting an owner-builder.

Good luck, you've already done more work than 90% of people I see building. It is darn near impossible to get contractors to show up at times and we are not even a strong building market. Choose them very wisely as I hear horror stories of how many people have hired and fired lately.

Interest rates are rising and I think things are going to slow significantly here so that may ease the problems with building and contractors.
 

Voodoo

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We are starting to see more shouse construction. I know some of it is "off the record." They built a pole barn then quietly finished part of it as a living area (often with porch and front door facing away from the road).

They have become popular here and everyone has a little different take on them... This one was one I recently had to "deal" with because it was in town and unique and huge. Will be nice and I am kinda jealous of the garage space. Would make a nice little basketball court for the kids.

share Shouse.gif
 

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Got my first quotes back on the excavation and radiant heat floor installation packaged:

1. Excavation $7,000
2. Radiant Heat $9,500 (Radiantec)

Both are higher than I was hoping. I think the excavation is high because it can be -- contractors around here have enough to keep them busy. I requested two quotes, and I was actually more impressed with the second guy. I am hoping he comes in closer to $5,000, but as long as he isn't much higher I would still go with him.

I have found another radiant floor company that designs and sells complete packages (Radiant Floor Company). I have requested their design recommendation and quote. Radiantec recommended a single on-demand boiler with two heating coils -- for domestic water and for floor heat. The technician I talked to was snarky and arrogant. I would rather not work with a company like that especially since I will need their support with installation. (I had told him that I read about another way of doing it, and his response was, "Ok. Do it your way. I hope it works." Instead he could have simply explained why his recommendation was better.)

From Radiantec:

Radiantec Quote.png
 

Voodoo

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Every single radiant heat system I see is different. Very odd but I don't think there is a right way. I was impressed with this last one but it was probably pretty expensive.
 

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dacrunch

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My thoughts are just concerns about "building a personal-use white elephant", non-standard to the future buyers in the housing market... If you have enough land to legally subdivide, it might be worth the trouble to build a new house on its own lot... ??? Just throwing this in... But the costs would be higher (building, utilities, property taxes)...
 

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My thoughts are just concerns about "building a personal-use white elephant", non-standard to the future buyers in the housing market... If you have enough land to legally subdivide, it might be worth the trouble to build a new house on its own lot... ??? Just throwing this in... But the costs would be higher (building, utilities, property taxes).
Zoning will permit a second dwelling on our lot. But each dwelling would be required to have seperate wells / septic (I believe). Also, there is not another permissible driveway location on the lot. (Driveway entries require 400 ft of visibility in both directions.)

I understand the concern about having a non-standard house. We were off-grid for 4 years, and could not get any financing because the house did not conform. This upgrade will actually move our house toward more standard. But more importantly, as long as Wisconsin remains a free state which recognizes the Bill of Rights we will be living here until we die. Selling (or value) is not an issue to me. Being able to live here comfortably for the rest of our lives is our primary concern.
 

gringott

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This has always been a concern of mine. Don't put in special features in a building you might sell one day. You normally won't get your money back and may even limit the potential market you are selling to. I also like simplicity. Complicated uncommon features, esp. mechanical ones, are sometimes expensive to maintain or replace, or even find a competent person to do the work. If you plan to always live there and have no plans of selling, then it makes sense. I see houses around here with features like soundproofing and 2x6 exterior walls, they go for the same price as the houses without. Non-traditional heating systems around here take longer to sell in my observation.

I'm not in Wisconsin however. Maybe the market is different in small town / rural Wisconsin. I don't know.

Edit: Just saw your last post. Not selling? No issues.
However, I would hardly call Wisconsin a "free state" when you have rules like you just posted. Seems you have much more restrictive building codes than we have around here. Are you allowed to take a dump without government permission?
 

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Are you allowed to take a dump without government permission?
No. Even outhouses require a sanitary permit and must be installed by a licensed plumber.
 

gringott

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No. Even outhouses require a sanitary permit and must be installed by a licensed plumber.
So I figured. I spent a lot of time in Wisconsin in my youth, my mom liked to fish, so we went there every summer. One branch of my family lives in Illinois on the Wisconsin border. They also have micro-managed property rights, so many "code" requirements that you will go broke meeting them unless you can pass them on to the buyer. My BIL, now retired, built custom homes for decades, now retired, my brother did the same, now in Kentucky, and my two nephews also were in the business. They now are out. The code requirements are now worse than Chicago if you can believe it. One nephew has a piece of land on a canal to a lake. He cannot do anything at all with the lot. No pier, no buildings, no driveway. They locked him out of doing anything at all. Sweet. I guess they can go stand on the land and say "this is mine". Oh, and pay the property taxes.
 

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Just found out that the lead time on windows is 3-4 months. (!)

Going to head down to Menards and get them ordered before 11% rebate expires tomorrow. Eight windows for $1,880 with a rebate of $200 I can put toward later materials. (About $210 per window, net)
 

gringott

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No. Even outhouses require a sanitary permit and must be installed by a licensed plumber.
I love it sir. Great answer. It used to be much different. Judging on my visits to Wiscosin and some of the homes I personally saw.
 

gringott

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Just found out that the lead time on windows is 3-4 months. (!)

Going to head down to Menards and get them ordered before 11% rebate expires tomorrow. Eight windows for $1,880 with a rebate of $200 I can put toward later materials. (About $210 per window, net)
Doesn't Menards have a 11% rebate all the time? When I bought cedar for my deck from them the rebate was 11% (ten years ago or so), when they opened the Menards here locally last year, the rebate on everything has been 11%, the whole time including now. I have never been there when they didn't have 11% rebate.

1645821296123.png
 

Barrettone

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Just found out that the lead time on windows is 3-4 months. (!)

Going to head down to Menards and get them ordered before 11% rebate expires tomorrow. Eight windows for $1,880 with a rebate of $200 I can put toward later materials. (About $210 per window, net)


Yep...I do select demolition for large commercial projects, and have a 35,000 sq ft 3-story school we are currently gutting to turn into senior housing. The GC (general contractor) was just told 22 weeks to get their windows (102 of them) when the guy came in to measure. Sign of the times. <sigh>
 

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Progress update:
  • Windows purchased. 6 of the 8 were in stock, so they are stored in the shed. Basement casement windows were "special order", so I don't expect to see them for a while. Total cost was more than expected because the smaller basement windows were 50% more because they were not a stock product.
  • 12 tons of lumber scheduled for delivery Monday. I was surprised that the cost of delivery was only $138. Now I have to figure out how to stack it all so the lumber I need first is on the top. Some will be stored in the garage if it is more susceptible to moisture damage, the rest will be set in the yard and tarped.
  • Got a better quote from the Radiant Floor Company (Vermont). Instead of an on-demand combi-boiler they recommend a larger on-demand heater for domestic water (8gpm instead of 5gpm we have) with a heat exchanger circuit for the floors. They also recommended 7/8" pex instead of 1/2". Total price is $6,800+shipping (instead of $9,500 from Radiantec). Next week we will finalize the configuration and get it ordered. I plan on installing the zone on the first floor of our current house right away. Then when I build the addition I will only need to connect the next two zones -- the system will already be in place and be functional.
  • Second excavation quote was slightly higher - $7,200. But I hired him anyway. He definitely seemed more experienced and more professional. Worth the extra $300 or so to have it done right. He said frost has to be gone AND ground has to be drained out before he digs. Might be middle May before he can start.
  • Carpenter estimate came back higher than I was hoping - $6,750. Tempts me to do it myself, but my wife is urging me to just pay them so it gets done faster and without adding stress to my life. I think we can squeeze it into the budget, but it doesn't leave room for surprises when we are finishing everything.
Went to Menards with my wife and we picked out siding (entire house and garage will get new siding). Settled on a darker shade of the same color we have -- sage green. She doesn't want to have anything to do with the rest of the house design (literally nothing), but when it comes to colors (inside and out) she always gets her way.

So before we break ground (May?) I will:
  • Install radiant floor system and new water heater
  • Disassemble half of the front porch and cantilever to support the roof
 

<SLV>

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Also got the permit application turned in with the $590 pretty-please bribe. I was told 1-2 weeks for processing. Zoning/sanitary looks at it first, then the building inspector. My "blue prints" were hand drawings on graph paper, so hopefully I showed enough to satisfy them. I am sort of expecting a phone call with additional questions.
 

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Basement Elevation South.png


Basement Floor Plan.png


Main Floor Plan.png


Elevation Cross Section.png
 

Voodoo

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So I figured. I spent a lot of time in Wisconsin in my youth, my mom liked to fish, so we went there every summer. One branch of my family lives in Illinois on the Wisconsin border. They also have micro-managed property rights, so many "code" requirements that you will go broke meeting them unless you can pass them on to the buyer. My BIL, now retired, built custom homes for decades, now retired, my brother did the same, now in Kentucky, and my two nephews also were in the business. They now are out. The code requirements are now worse than Chicago if you can believe it. One nephew has a piece of land on a canal to a lake. He cannot do anything at all with the lot. No pier, no buildings, no driveway. They locked him out of doing anything at all. Sweet. I guess they can go stand on the land and say "this is mine". Oh, and pay the property taxes.

If you can't do anything with the land then it has no utility and therefore no value. No value means no taxes, well at no taxes should be paid.
 

ttazzman

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i 100% agree with giving the permiting people minimum information (drwgs) ......its been my experience that the more you give them the more they want so its easier to short them up front and let them do their dance ..cry a bit...n go on......the less you show them the more flexibility you have
 

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On your foundation plan...it shows 96" above the slab, and the slab is above the footer. Which means the forms for the walls will have to be more than 8 foot tall. Does that create a problem for the concrete guys? Seems it would add cost. I see guys here pouring the slab level with the footing to avoid this, which leaves an ugly seam, or just have a lower ceiling in the basement if you put the slab on top of footing.
 

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On your foundation plan...it shows 96" above the slab, and the slab is above the footer. Which means the forms for the walls will have to be more than 8 foot tall. Does that create a problem for the concrete guys? Seems it would add cost. I see guys here pouring the slab level with the footing to avoid this, which leaves an ugly seam, or just have a lower ceiling in the basement if you put the slab on top of footing.
It is ICFs (insulated concrete forms). They will have to cut the top row of blocks to hit my wall height, but no big deal. I want a finished ceiling height in the basement of 8ft, and there will be no drop ceiling because I don't have ductwork.
 

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Just read over at ZeroHedge that copper prices are lagging everything else, and Russia is a big producer of copper. Decided I would head out to Menards and pick up 500ft of 12-2 before the 11% expires tonight. Who knows what the price will be in a few months.

1646528767226.png
 

ttazzman

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Just read over at ZeroHedge that copper prices are lagging everything else, and Russia is a big producer of copper. Decided I would head out to Menards and pick up 500ft of 12-2 before the 11% expires tonight. Who knows what the price will be in a few months.

View attachment 248023

I keep a supply of varying copper romex types and sizes just like i keep PMs ...........its a good way to play copper
 

hoarder

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It is ICFs (insulated concrete forms). They will have to cut the top row of blocks to hit my wall height, but no big deal. I want a finished ceiling height in the basement of 8ft, and there will be no drop ceiling because I don't have ductwork.
Or cut the bottom row of ICF blocks so there will be more precision at the top.
 

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When I was assembling my ICF, I had many blocks that I had to cut for size. What worked for me was to take a four foot section, cut out a piece of the middle, and glue the two pieces together with spray foam.

To keep the alignment just right, I put an intact 4 foot section on the bottom and put saran wrap where the foam joint would be. Then I put the first piece to glue on top and sprayed the foam on the four edges, and put the second piece with the first. Then I put saran on top of the two pieces and put another intact section on top. The foam filled perfectly.
 

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There are several companies that make ICF forms. When I built my log cabin, the concrete guys used Fox Blocks. Most likely each type or brand of ICF has an ideal foundation dimension where little or no splicing is required.
 

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Just found out that the lead time on windows is 3-4 months. (!)

Going to head down to Menards and get them ordered before 11% rebate expires tomorrow. Eight windows for $1,880 with a rebate of $200 I can put toward later materials. (About $210 per window, net)
You guys up North do you get triple pane windows or double pane-gas-filled ?