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New currency discussion footed on a Gold Standard.

Buck

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#4
Gold is the yardstick, not the object being measured.

The US dollar has rebounded from 1/1900th of an ounce of gold to 1/1300th of an ounce.
.
.
To validate that, look at other countries fiat conversions to gold
Using the USD for our purchases, we got it better than most other countries/currencies

Buy It While It's Still Cheap and that ain't no lie
 

skychief

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#5
Banks make their money by making loans on assets they don't have.

The gov't borrows money from the banks, and pays interest on the borrowed money with debt notes backed by nothing (Federal Reserve Notes).

With a "Gold standard" none of this is possible.

There will not be any more gold standards. It would shift power from banks (and the gov't) to people who actually have gold. They won't allow that.
 

FunnyMoney

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#6
...With a "Gold standard" none of this is possible.

There will not be any more gold standards. It would shift power from banks (and the gov't) to people who actually have gold. They won't allow that.
Mafias don't like anyone adjusting their racket. They tried to kill both Andrew Jackson and Ronald Reagan and came within inches. There were no mistakes with JFK, MLK, RFK.
 
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ZZZZZ

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#7
Speaking of the Liberty Dollar, this hit the news yesterday,


Infamous 'Liberty Dollar' Is Back

1 2 3 4

Silver Certificates
LIVE OAK, Fla. - March 14, 2019 - PRLog -- The original silver-backed Liberty Dollar is available again.

Kathy Hicks of Live Oak, with her husband Wayne, have revived it through the new Liberty Dollar Network, which encourages sound-money supporters to exchange their U.S. dollars, which are secured by the government's promise to pay, for silver-backed Live Oak Liberty Dollars. These are 100% backed by and exchangeable for silver bullion that is stored in an independently operated, audited vault.

Live Oak Liberty Dollars are available as paper Silver Certificates and digital eLD that can be used online and anywhere via a smartphone app. They are based on the original Liberty Dollar, which was shut down by the U.S. Treasury after a notorious raid that almost sent Liberty Dollar founder Bernard von NotHaus to prison for life.

The new version of the Liberty Dollar is backed by pure .999 fine silver valued at $25 USD per ounce. The valuation is set higher than the current price of silver because, as Kathy Hicks, President of the Liberty Dollar Network, explains, "You can't base a currency on the market value of a commodity, because the price changes daily. The new Liberty Dollar is based on a reasonable future valuation that gives Members and Merchants a greater trading value. When the price of silver rises, the current $25 Silver Base will raise all existing currency to a higher valuation, increasing its purchasing power."

Wayne Hicks, Marketing Director of Liberty Dollar Network, emphasizes that "silver holds its value, so the new currency protects people from rising prices better than the U.S. dollar, which is subject to inflation. Network Members can redeem the Live Oak Liberty Dollar for silver at any time."

The new Live Oak Liberty Dollar was designed by monetary architect Bernard von NotHaus, the same expert who created the original Liberty Dollar, to be attractive, durable and as difficult to counterfeit as any national currency.

When asked about the new currency, von NotHaus said, "I'm delighted that Kathy Hicks asked me to design the new Liberty Dollar. She's done a fantastic job of getting the Liberty Dollar Network set up and re-inventing the Liberty Dollar as a community currency program that will benefit the people and local businesses in Live Oak and other communities when inflation once again devalues the zero-backed fiat U.S. dollar."

Contact:
Kathy and Wayne Hicks
admin@LibertyDollar.net
888.421.6181
https://www.libertydollar.net

https://www.prlog.org/12759472-infamous-liberty-dollar-is-back.html
.
.
 

GOLDBRIX

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#8
I wonder how long it will be before FEDS raid their "...independently operated, audited vault " ?
That is the ONLY difference I have found so far between the old Lib. & the Live Oak Lib.

Tick, Tock, Tick Tock. :bomb:
 

Cigarlover

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#10
So if you buy the silver certificate you can exchange it for 4 ounces of silver or hold it for a year and exchange it for 5 ounces of silver.
Or, you can just go buy silver for 15.50 an ounce and get 6 ounces of silver.
 

GOLDBRIX

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#11
OR
You have silver and you exchange your physical silver for their's at $25.00 a T.oz valued script.
Still worry about FEDS shutting them down...AGAIN!!
 

Buck

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#12
Their mistake is calling it a "dollar."
While I agree, I was thinking:

Canada: Dollar
Australia: Dollar
etc

there are a few countries that claim the "Dollar" title for their non-US Dollar currency


but, they're all part of the CB system, so, it's all good
 

GOLDBRIX

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#13
While I agree, I was thinking:

Canada: Dollar
Australia: Dollar
etc

there are a few countries that claim the "Dollar" title for their non-US Dollar currency


but, they're all part of the CB system, so, it's all good
You don't see merchants taking Canadian or Australian "DOLLARs" in trading in the United States of America, Inc.
There lies the difference.
 

Buck

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#15
Small Detail:
No one near me accepts anything other than plastic or USD
No one takes NORFED, Silver or Gold, in a general type setting and honestly, we're basically on the same page (I think), from this point on, barring a calamity, no one ever will again, in a general type transaction, around me

If it happens, I may climb aboard, especially if someone accepts a silver dime for $1.50 worth of merchandise, but lots of folks got burned on the last Liberty attempt and that's not good for anyone. It makes for a tough sale, to bring people aboard, when they read that people got taken to the cleaners with the last attempt

Like Bitcoin, things that just won't work, they will work, but, without acceptance at the places I buy from, it's but a dream

Collector Value is another thing altogether...collectors are weird like that
 

GOLDBRIX

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#16
Open a Carry-out. Accept all forms of payment.
Pre '65 silver coins and gold receive a significant discount towards the purchase.
I know U-tube has a video or two where store owners accept PMs as payment.
 

Buck

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#17
Open a Carry-out. Accept all forms of payment.
Pre '65 silver coins and gold receive a significant discount towards the purchase.
I know U-tube has a video or two where store owners accept PMs as payment.
Baby Steps, that's for sure but what would an accounting spread-sheet look like for those who do this?
IRS Audits could go very wonky to say the least, especially if the IRS becomes another tool for another corrupt adminstration

As a merchant, I'd treat as much as would be reasonable as a 'cash transaction' but, if that were to be discovered, or even made-up, an allegation by the auditors, life would soon become very cumbersome for the merchant



If we'd only be left alone, all US sheep could figure it out, on our own, but, that won't happen because .gov will always want their cut of the pie

I'm hoping with you all, but my pessimism is running amok. We The People generally get NOTHING, even if we made it work, all on our own

I'm ready with some 90% dimes in my hand but if no one will accept them for the value they truly posses, it's like beating a dead horse to offer them in exchange for the merchandise I want/need


With Trump in office, NOW is a really great time to get a program such as this, off the ground, really off the ground, but, as others have noted, the exchange rate, the premiums for using PM's, is still too high and we're actually going to be paying a new type of "private CB" and is THAT what we really want?
 

FunnyMoney

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#18
You can not get around Gresham's law.

Justice and honesty come through law - constitutional law.

The Founders understood that you need to base the financial system upon honest money and wrote "gold" and "silver" specifically into the constitution as law to be enforced.

Dishonest money has a tendency to lose value, eventually to zero. This is sped up by any alternative currency which is honest and being used, and by the corrupted systems / entities that grow up around these core monetary crimes.
 
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#19
I was reading some posts on various websites this morning, and came across some mentions of our recent press release. If you like, you can read it here.
What caught my attention, however, was that several people commented that the Liberty Dollar Network can’t survive, because “it won’t be long before the feds raid them and take all the silver...”

Now, we all know what happened to Bernard von NotHaus and the original Liberty Dollar, but apparently there’s some confusion about why it happened. I think it might be time to clear that up a bit.

The Liberty Dollar was a wonderful idea, but there was one little detail in the law that was missed when Bernard asked his attorneys to give him their opinion on its legality. That little detail was 18 USC 486, which states that it is against the law to issue coins or bars of “gold, silver or other metals” for use as current money. “Current money” is defined as whatever is being used in commerce, and the federal government decide that the Silver Libertys were in violation.

Merely possessing Silver Libertys was not a crime; for that reason, the federal courts did eventually order all those issued prior to the government’s injunction to be returned to their rightful owners, and Bernard is still completing redemptions to this very day.

The Silver Certificates issued by NORFED, however, were not in violation of that statute. They were lawful warehouse receipts, long established in law as negotiable instruments that can be used as security for debt or traded for items of value. It was only the use of actual silver in commerce that constituted a crime, and that is why the Liberty Dollar Network does not offer any kind of coin or round to be used as currency. We offer only Silver Certificates that follow the same formula used for those of the Liberty Dollar, which are already established as legal.

In addition, the Liberty Dollar Network is working within the established guidelines of a Money Service Business, which is required by law. In doing so, we are meeting all the criteria of a legal financial business, and have nothing to fear from the Federal Government. I don’t think there’s any real risk of our being shut down or raided, and I hope this clears up the confusion. If anyone has questions, I’ll be happy to answer them.

Thanks for reading.

Kathy Hicks
President
Liberty Dollar Network
https://www.libertydollar.net
 

GOLDBRIX

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#20
As a merchant, I'd treat as much as would be reasonable as a 'cash transaction' but, if that were to be discovered, or even made-up, an allegation by the auditors, life would soon become very cumbersome for the merchant
I didn't say it was easy. I said it could be done.
U.S. Bullion = Face Value minted on the Coins + discount (you set) for the merchandise bought by the buyer.
You are not paying people. You are discounting your mechandise you sell.

This is nothing new my grandfather and my dad ( 2 separate businesses) would trade their groceries for "running a tab" or a barter transaction which ever worked better for the customer.

40+ years ago my dad took in a 10K Au ring w/a monster oval (man-made) ruby (10mmX13mm) ring for two bags of groceries. The family never reclaimed or asked to get the ring back.
20+ years ago he gave the ring to me ( my birth month) as a gift.
About 15 yrs ago a jeweler friend of mine saw it and gave me a verbal appraisal of $750.00 then.

Back in late 50s / early 60s grandpa took in an OLD (back then) S&W 38 special w/ Mother of Pearl grips, to clear a good customer's I.O.U.s. He kept the revolver in the safe up near the banded cash as protection. Never got robbed in the daylight. Break-ins after hours were another matter.

So it can be done. As you said "Baby Steps".
 
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Buck

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#21
GB, while this is all well and good, imagine the confusion on the faces of all the sheep, let alone any immigrants who suffer from ESL, as they attempt to utilize their poor math skills to properly compute which form of 'money' will give them the best value

Baby Steps, but after reading Kathy's explanation, it still begs of the word fiat money. If we're not actually using silver or gold or brass for daily transactions, but rather using paper notes, except for the fact of keeping the Fed and it's fiat out of the transaction, all of it seems like it is to no avail.

People DID accept using paper money in place of coinage as it was lighter and easier to use, merchants can store paper easier than metals, etc, convenience

There is an easier method, simply abolish the Fed and change the acceptance of the IRS so they can accept PM's as payment towards tax liabilities

But, But, if the country began to utilize various forms of barter for what could be argued is a taxable transaction, at the end of the day, right now, the IRS only wants one thing: paper money in the same form, from all of it's customers.

USD will still be required, at the end of the day, and until that control is 'given up', that demand of paying taxes is 'given up', a single format will always be required to fulfill that demand

For example:
Imagine your business only accepts specie money for all transactions, your books are in order, all audits are acceptable, nothing has been done wrong, in order to pay your taxes, one would need to convert one's specie into USD and the exchange rate for that will either make you a profit, unlikely, or it will cost you some profit, more than likely, because every transaction into/out of specie will require a vig, to someone

Cost of doing business?
In my business, my job is to cut costs, many business people are not interested in utilizing something else that will cost them profits at the end of the day. Probably one reason Cryptos are not used, idk

Until the Fed is abolished, until the IRS accepts specie as a tax obligation payment, until people's math skills rise back to the level of Freshman High School, until we get out of the coup condition, until...lots of societal things, this can't happen on a sea to shining sea level.

State wise? Sure, if enough citizens would like to make it occur, but there are 200 million (est) of US who spend money daily, conduct taxable transactions daily, and unless the IRS feels satisfied, they're only going to get peeved at US for doing this, legally or not, and their kangaroo court will not be kind to us for not paying them their vig in the currency of their choosing.

I don't see it as really that complicated but add in the IRS and suddenly we have an elephant in the room, crapping on everything, waving it's trunk around, breaking things and possessing an ability to put it's foot down crushing everything in it's way, while being completely oblivious to the damage it's doing to everything


Barter IS the thing to do, but ultimately, that's also where the IRS begins to feel 'left out' and they will audit everything until the day comes, they've got another stranglehold on that system:
Two Dozen Eggs do not equal the value of two heads of lettuce, so, you own the IRS the difference, pay up in USD

i just envision the act of 'going backwards', back towards a foundation we used to have as being like getting that elephant out of the room before the destruction happens but, the destruction will happen anyways as the elephant has to leave the room and until it does, we all know the results

However, it does offer options, species transactions through 'fiat', convertible 'fiat' mind you, is a novel approach but, it's still fiat

If you don't hold it, you may not really own it will still apply


my 2¢
 

Cigarlover

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#23
Imagine your business only accepts specie money for all transactions, your books are in order, all audits are acceptable, nothing has been done wrong, in order to pay your taxes, one would need to convert one's specie into USD and the exchange rate for that will either make you a profit, unlikely, or it will cost you some profit, more than likely, because every transaction into/out of specie will require a vig, to someone
As we discussed earlier, where you really run into issues is when you need to pay bills and the people you pay will only accept FRN's. Then you have to cash in some metal to pay it and the gain on that metal is taxable. So if you take a 1 dollar silver eagle and trade it for 15 FRN's then the 14 dollars is a gain and is taxable.

However, if you were working in a system that was based entirely on gold and silver you could work for 50 bucks a week or 1 gold eagle. At the end of the year you have only earned 2600 dollars and as such no tax would be due. In fact no tax return would even need to be filed.

To go a step further, if you are a taxpayer in the first place then you are only about 3% of the total population in the US who is legally required to even pay a tax on the labor they exchange for money.
I have been procrastinating on this but will get it posted soon for all to see the law for themselves.
 

GOLDBRIX

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#24
I'm not sayin' every customer is going to want to offer Au/Ag for transaction. As it stands right now I'd say less than 2% would even ask or take up a transaction.
There will be cash in the register or wallet or bank for the vast majority of business transactions.
AND
To this very day I'd be willing to say most businessmen know tricks and tactics that reduce reportable income. Be it a technicality in accounting, Loop hole(s) left by politicians, or periodically under reporting.
 
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#25
I'm very aware of what happened to Mr. von NotHaus, since he's one of our dearest friends and my personal mentor. I've done a lot of research on the Liberty Dollar, and you have to look at the final result, not the propaganda that was put out through the press. Silver Certificate Warehouse Receipts are legal for use as current money, even though they are not legal tender.

They are also, however, not fiat. These silver certificates are documents of title to specific amounts of silver that can be redeemed by the bearer on demand, and this legality is long established in law. Fiat refers to a currency issued by decree of government or monarch.

In addition, we offer a service no one else does: for Members of the Network, including Merchants, we will buy the silver back at any time for exactly the price we would charge them for it, so that they can access fiat currency when they need to.

The real benefit of Liberty Dollars, though, is that they continue to circulate within the community. Most Merchants will simply keep them to use at other Merchants, thereby saving the FRN's for paying debts and taxes outside the local economy.
 
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#26
One thing I should point out is that the Liberty Dollar Network is not a political organization. While we know that sound money is a good thing, we are not out to compete with US Dollars, or any other kind. Our focus is on what this currency can do for local communities, and there is a lot of groundwork in that regard that has already been done. We've already got people interested in seeing it work in their communities across America, and even in other countries. It's being explored by communities in Japan and Mexico right now, and we just got notice that BankNote Rep[orter is about to do a major story on its benefits for Australia, NZ and the UK. The future looks pretty exciting, right now, and we've already been visited by LE to check us out. So far, they say they can't see any problem with what we're doing and wish us good luck.
 

GOLDBRIX

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#27
government is made up of known liars and criminals (see red book covers below). Liars cannot be trusted ever. Warehouse receipts backed by gold or silver are still better than a fiat currency and therefore clearly represent a threat to every fiat currency system. Every fiat currency system is owned and regulated by the same band of criminals guaranteed. They can alter the laws according to their whims.
YEP, Ask the HUNT Brothers who tried to corner the Ag market.
Multi-millionaires turned into just millionaires by the manipulation of the Margin Requirements in the middle of the game and without .gov review of the change. ( without notice)
 

GOLDBRIX

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#29
Where did they go? What happened to the Montana Freemen?
I know some are in OR were in PRISON.
As the liens they filed were determined invalid so those who filed went to the Federal Gray joints.
 

FunnyMoney

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#31
Not sure if I'm going to make anyone mad with this, but we're working on making a movie about Bernard von NotHaus and the Liberty Dollar case. https://www.themonetaryarchitect.com
I went to the link and they've only raised $42 for the $200,000 they're looking for.

When Haans (no longer a GIM member - mods removed all trace of him at his request after being run out of dodge), well when Haans posted those videos, it seemed he was trying to tell us that the anti-christ is going to be some institutional cooperation between American monetary and military might along with some kind of influence coming out of that place in Rome (the one that begins with a 'v'). I'm still unclear on all the details there but I do remember them specifically mentioning the Sabbath day of rest and that gov't would tell the world populations that they must adhere to that, by their own law and enforced by them, and that somehow they convince the world this will solve all our problems. If your confused, well, like I said on another thread, I tried to get some questions in but the mods obliged to his "delete everything" request and well, I don't even remember my questions now.

But anyway, maybe we could get a preview of some of the movie's script posted here, and that might help with the donations.
 
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#32
A few donations came in over the last day or so, it's almost up to $2k now. I messaged the producer about getting the script posted, but he said that "isn't done" and will send me the "storyline" next week, instead. *shrugs* I'll post it when I get it. Meanwhile, thanks to whoever made the donations. If it was some of you folks, pat yourselves on the back. This is a part of history that needs to be told.
 

Scorpio

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#33
I tried to get some questions in but the mods obliged to his "delete everything" request and well, I don't even remember my questions now.
don't know what you are speaking to other than the drugs again,

I have never deleted anyone in total, ever. Nor would I. Been requested many times and never have.

He went thru and deleted himself,

He was only taken out when he was deleting then leaving a 1 behind on every post and thread.

So quit spreading out and out lies about the mods here.
 
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FunnyMoney

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#34
...

So quit spreading out and out lies about the mods here.
It wasn't anything against the mods. It was a poor attempt at a joke.

Haans was run out of dodge. You guys just simply obliged with his wishes when he decided to escape from here. Not sure why he was so interested in deleting things - burning all the bridges prior to leaving. That is still a confusing part.

I wasn't blaming the mods, I was more taking note of the utter frustration that he must have felt when he packed his things and left - as if there might be some knowledge to be gained there.

Did you watch any of the videos he posted? It seemed like he was onto something important. "Actionable intel" I'm not so sure, but the fact he left in such a hurry, and with no trace of ever even having been here, it may indeed be a warning.