• "Spreading the ideas of freedom loving people on matters regarding high finance, politics, constructionist Constitution, and mental masturbation of all types"

PayPal Refund Policy Change

stas3000

Silver Miner
Seeker
Joined
Jan 7, 2012
Messages
571
Likes
381
Location
USA
#1
Not sure if it's been posted already, but earlier this month PP announced several policy/pricing changes. One of them has a potential to really hurt if you sell (on eBay, etc) and issue refunds. In the past and currently, most of the PP fee could be reversed in case of refund. Not anymore. More on PP's Web site, DoC and lots of other places. Bad news.

https://www.doctorofcredit.com/majo...-order-cancellation-affects-ebay-sellers-etc/
 

Irons

Deep Sixed
Sr Site Supporter
Mother Lode
Joined
Mar 30, 2010
Messages
28,664
Likes
50,062
#2
Between ebay fees paypal fees increases in package mailing fees and everybody expecting free shipping on everything (thanks amazon)
I have given up trying to sell things on ebay. You end up giving your stuff away.
We just dump everything at goodwill for the tax break.


.
 

Irons

Deep Sixed
Sr Site Supporter
Mother Lode
Joined
Mar 30, 2010
Messages
28,664
Likes
50,062
#4
When eBay takes away advantages for the sake of increasing profits they'll go the way of the dodo bird like every other business that has done the same before them
My LCS guy was very active on ebay for years with a store and over 100k sales and positive feedbacks. He gave up on ebay over a year ago.
They jacked up his fees until he was lucky to break even on a sale. Greedy feckers.

.
 

stas3000

Silver Miner
Seeker
Joined
Jan 7, 2012
Messages
571
Likes
381
Location
USA
#5
I don't have much info on the subject, but heard that eBay is slowly rolling out its own payment system which will eventually replace PayPal. I think it's all part of the deal when eBay spun off PP several years ago. Wondering how good that new service is going to be and what it will cost.

But as to this change... if you cancel a $500 eBay order because buyer made a mistake, for example, then you as a seller will be stuck with paying $15 to PP. Not end of the world I guess but what the heck?
 

glockngold

Gold Member
Gold Chaser
Site Supporter ++
Joined
Mar 31, 2010
Messages
3,251
Likes
3,935
#6
As I read it, the new paypal policy will do the most damage to sellers that suffer from a high return rate.
Chick clothing sellers will take a beating.
I sell in a low return category (tools) & have had one remorse return in the last year.
So I won't get hurt.
Iron's coin shop guy was selling on ebay where he had to compete with individual sellers that just got grandpa's coin collection & are selling to the public at melt minus 15% total fees, & are tickled to get it.
As always, you make your money when you buy.
So buy right.
 

Uglytruth

Gold Member
Gold Chaser
Site Supporter
Joined
Apr 6, 2011
Messages
6,179
Likes
8,919
#7
Let see....
Ebay made money when it bought pay pal.
Ebay made money when it sold off pay pal.
Ebay makes money by doing their own credit card payment.

Ever feel like a manipulated puppet?
 

stas3000

Silver Miner
Seeker
Joined
Jan 7, 2012
Messages
571
Likes
381
Location
USA
#8
This whole thing is basically a price increase from PP without changing the face value of processing fees. So those that do suffer from a relatively high return rate, may increase prices or change return policies (like store credit vs refund). We'll see.
 

Son of Gloin

Certainty of death? What are we waiting for?
Gold Chaser
Midas Supporter
Joined
Apr 6, 2010
Messages
5,811
Likes
12,171
Location
USA
#9
I just got a refund through PayPal. The seller never shipped my item, a DVD set. This is trivial, but instead of the money going right into my paypal account, it was diverted to my checking account, where it has yet to appear. That isn’t a problem, as long as it eventually appears back in my checking account.
 

stas3000

Silver Miner
Seeker
Joined
Jan 7, 2012
Messages
571
Likes
381
Location
USA
#10
I just got a refund through PayPal. The seller never shipped my item, a DVD set. This is trivial, but instead of the money going right into my paypal account, it was diverted to my checking account, where it has yet to appear. That isn’t a problem, as long as it eventually appears back in my checking account.
You probably won't see anything until about 5 business days from the point refund was issued. That's been my experience with refunds for purchases made via eBay if funds were swept into seller's own checking/savings account. If the seller had PP balance then you would get funds faster. And PP refunds usually go back to the checking account, credit card or whatever form of payment you used when making the purchase. I personally prefer to use credit cards when using eBay or PayPal unless it's a Friends and Family/Gift type of deal.
 

Thecrensh

Gold Member
Gold Chaser
Joined
Jun 26, 2013
Messages
5,998
Likes
7,518
#11
My LCS guy was very active on ebay for years with a store and over 100k sales and positive feedbacks. He gave up on ebay over a year ago.
They jacked up his fees until he was lucky to break even on a sale. Greedy feckers.

.
That policy change will cause people to seek out alternative options for conducting sale...free market processes.
 

Krag

Planet earth
Platinum Bling
Joined
Feb 20, 2013
Messages
4,748
Likes
3,803
#12
I've done hundreds of thousands in dollars in the last few years on ebay, I have no idea how anyone could cope with returns where you would have to pay for return shipping then lose 3%! Ebay is apparently looking at alternatives to paypal; I wonder why they announced such a crappy policy.
 

hammerhead

Morphing
Gold Chaser
Sr Site Supporter
Joined
Feb 22, 2012
Messages
6,585
Likes
7,426
Location
On a speck of dust
#13
Other than reaching a wide market area, the costs really have to get considered if you are going to sell. Been a long time since I even browsed the bay. How much are fees now?
 

Krag

Planet earth
Platinum Bling
Joined
Feb 20, 2013
Messages
4,748
Likes
3,803
#14
Other than reaching a wide market area, the costs really have to get considered if you are going to sell. Been a long time since I even browsed the bay. How much are fees now?
Powerseller, top rated are 5.5% plus the 3% paypal. Were 1.9/2.2 a few years ago.
 

Son of Gloin

Certainty of death? What are we waiting for?
Gold Chaser
Midas Supporter
Joined
Apr 6, 2010
Messages
5,811
Likes
12,171
Location
USA
#15
Powerseller, top rated are 5.5% plus the 3% paypal. Were 1.9/2.2 a few years ago.
Greed will kill their business. The only good thing they’ve done is to allow sellers to list fee free and only pay when and if they sell their listing. That way, they get people to be willing to list items. I am no power seller, but as a seller, I do have a perfect feedback rating, five star, 100%. It is 10% fees for me with eBay and PP, no matter what I sell. I sold an expensive collector knife several months ago for about $900. I was very surprised to see that $90 in fees. I got way over original cost, but they stuck it to me.
 

davycoppitt

Silver Member
Silver Miner
Site Supporter ++
Joined
Apr 1, 2010
Messages
630
Likes
1,248
#16
As I read it, the new paypal policy will do the most damage to sellers that suffer from a high return rate.
Chick clothing sellers will take a beating.
I sell in a low return category (tools) & have had one remorse return in the last year.
So I won't get hurt.
Iron's coin shop guy was selling on ebay where he had to compete with individual sellers that just got grandpa's coin collection & are selling to the public at melt minus 15% total fees, & are tickled to get it.
As always, you make your money when you buy.
So buy right.
My state also added sales tax so it makes my buys harder. I've bought about 1/10th off eBay since then. With all that it still beats meeting freaks off craigslist.
 

Krag

Planet earth
Platinum Bling
Joined
Feb 20, 2013
Messages
4,748
Likes
3,803
#17
I don't know how Apmex sells so cheap on ebay, especially on holiday weekends, maybe in a few days?
 

Krag

Planet earth
Platinum Bling
Joined
Feb 20, 2013
Messages
4,748
Likes
3,803
#18
My state also added sales tax so it makes my buys harder. I've bought about 1/10th off eBay since then. With all that it still beats meeting freaks off craigslist.
I'd open some type of business account, ie a DBA with your state that would pass muster with ebay. I have to upload a copy of my numismatics business license so I won't get dinged with sales taxes which don't apply any way in CT.
 
Last edited:

GOLDBRIX

God,Donald Trump,most in GIM2 I Trust. OTHERS-meh
Sr Site Supporter
Platinum Bling
Joined
Apr 4, 2010
Messages
9,366
Likes
10,731
#19
When eBay takes away advantages for the sake of increasing profits they'll go the way of the dodo bird like every other business that has done the same before them
The ONLY thing I use Ebay for is for finding actual Selling Prices. I haven't bought anything through them in years.
 

ttazzman

Midas Member
Midas Member
Sr Site Supporter
Joined
Apr 2, 2010
Messages
5,393
Likes
5,406
Location
mid-usa
#20
I imagine PP will have to revise its business model somewhat when Ebay opens up direct CC payment ...........i have been getting crap weekly from them for over a year doing everything they can to coerce me into gettting their CC ........I do admit i beat them on fees regularly using the friends and family option for person to person purchases

PP without Ebay will be a weak business model i would imagine
 

Son of Gloin

Certainty of death? What are we waiting for?
Gold Chaser
Midas Supporter
Joined
Apr 6, 2010
Messages
5,811
Likes
12,171
Location
USA
#21
The ONLY thing I use Ebay for is for finding actual Selling Prices. I haven't bought anything through them in years.
The only thing I use eBay for, to buy, is stuff that just isn’t available for sale anywhere else. Collector books, especially, collectible out of production knives, also out of print DVD’s, etc.
 

the_shootist

Midas Member
Midas Member
Midas Supporter
Joined
May 31, 2015
Messages
30,203
Likes
38,114
#22
I use eBay to buy and Craigslist to sell. eBay is pro buyer and anti seller. Craigslist is free and easy to advertise and sell from as long as you follow a few basic guidelines.
 

the_shootist

Midas Member
Midas Member
Midas Supporter
Joined
May 31, 2015
Messages
30,203
Likes
38,114
#23
The only thing I use eBay for, to buy, is stuff that just isn’t available for sale anywhere else. Collector books, especially, collectible out of production knives, also out of print DVD’s, etc.
eBay can be a treasure trove for a buyer and a nightmare for a seller. Think about who actually pays eBay and you realize the eBay merchants are going after their cut of the profits. Punishing a seller is like killing the golden goose. All decisions (unless thoroughly blatant) go in favor of the buyer (i.e. cash cow). No buyers, no cash flows....basic (((merchant))) principle
 

Goldhedge

Moderator
Site Mgr
Sr Site Supporter
Joined
Mar 28, 2010
Messages
38,633
Likes
57,680
Location
Rocky Mountains
#24
Between ebay fees paypal fees increases in package mailing fees and everybody expecting free shipping on everything (thanks amazon)
AMZN isn't 'free' shipping. Costs $120/yr?? for 'free'... It's a great deal if you buy a whole bunch on AMZN and typically, the cost of the item is more than what can normally be had without Prime.

What is good is streaming videos on Firestick etc. and prepaid returns.

I cut the cord and saved $50/month which offsets the AMZn fee.