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South Africa: Land Expropriation, High Crime & Other News

edsl48

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IMF Supports South Africa Land Theft Provided It's "Rules Based"


byMike Mish Shedlock
17 hrs-edited

A land grab in Zimbabwe led to capital and human flight followed by hyperinflation. South Africa is on a similar path.
The ruling African National Congress (ANC) plans to change the constitution to allow the expropriation of land without compensation, as most of it is still owned by members of the white minority.
The ANC announced the plans, backed off them but now they are back on again, this time with IMF Backing Provided it's 'Rules Based'.
The debate erupted again last week when U.S. President Donald Trump said he had asked Secretary of State Mike Pompeo to study South African “land and farm seizures” and the “killing of farmers”. South Africa accused Trump of stoking racial divisions.
The IMF Fund’s senior resident representative in South Africa Montfort Mlachila told Reuters “We are in full support of the need to undertake land reforms in order to address the issues of inequality.”​
Land Reform?
We are not talking about land reform, we are talking about a land grab theft.
The ANC announced the plan, backed off and now it appears the plan is back on, with support from the IMF.
IMF Financial Support
Mlachila said South Africa was not expected to seek IMF financial support due to its deep domestic financial markets and access to international markets for financing its balance of payments and fiscal deficits.
“We really don’t see much need for recourse to financing from the IMF,” Mlachila said.​
If there is human and capital flight after this theft, South Africa will indeed be headed for IMF support.
Recall that the hyperinflation in Zimbabwe began with a land grab in the interest of "fairness".
In the sake of "fairness" the Zimbabwe currency went to zero, for everybody.
Trump's Controversial Tweet

Donald J. Trump

@realDonaldTrump



I have asked Secretary of State @SecPompeo to closely study the South Africa land and farm seizures and expropriations and the large scale killing of farmers. “South African Government is now seizing land from white farmers.” @TuckerCarlson @FoxNews
9:28 PM - Aug 22, 2018



NPR: The U.S. Embassy cited a recent report by AgriSA, a nonprofit industry group that represents 70,000 commercial farmers, that estimated that there were 47 farm murders from 2017 to 2018, fewer than at any time in the past 19 years. Police records documented 74 farm murders out of a total of 19,016 total murders in South Africa between April 2016 and March 2017.
Customers Must Honor Home loan Payments even if Land is Seized
Nedbank says Customers Must Honor Home loan Payments even if Land is Seized.
A South African bank has sparked a firestorm of criticism after informing customers they would still have to pay off their mortgage even if their property is seized by the government.
In an email circulating on social media, an official from Nedbank — one of the country’s big five banks — informed the customer that “bond payments remain due” regardless of any expropriation, “with or without compensation”.
A Nedbank spokesman said clients were urged to “be patient as this process unfolds”. “Until there’s further clarity on this process, it is business as usual at Nedbank,” he said.
It comes as tensions reach fever pitch after Donald Trump’s controversial comments last week on the racially charged issue of land redistribution sparked an international incident and accusations the US President was peddling a “white supremacist” conspiracy theory.
Civil rights group Afriforum, which represents the white Afrikaner minority, alleges that white farmers are being targeted in a brutal campaign of politically motivated farm attacks.
The exact numbers of people killed in such attacks is disputed. The AgriSA union representing commercial farmers says the number was 47 last year, Afriforum says the real number is 84.​
Bottom Line
There are a lot of charges and suppositions on both sides that obscure one simple point: One does not fix injustice with more injustice.
Any plan to confiscate land in the name of "justice" is not just and is bound to fail.
Mike "Mish" Shedlock
 

Fatrat

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Might makes right, if you can steal it, you should, just ask the Israelis...we can't lead by example here guys, we were silent when it counted.
 

arminius

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Customers Must Honor Home loan Payments even if Land is Seized
Nedbank says Customers Must Honor Home loan Payments even if Land is Seized.
A South African bank has sparked a firestorm of criticism after informing customers they would still have to pay off their mortgage even if their property is seized by the government.​
In an email circulating on social media, an official from Nedbank — one of the country’s big five banks — informed the customer that “bond payments remain due” regardless of any expropriation, “with or without compensation”.​
A Nedbank spokesman said clients were urged to “be patient as this process unfolds”. “Until there’s further clarity on this process, it is business as usual at Nedbank,” he said.​
Business as usual meaning customers get stabbed in the bank, err, back, as well as financially raped.​
That's sooooo black...​
 

Libertaurum

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Might makes right, if you can steal it, you should, just ask the Israelis...we can't lead by example here guys, we were silent when it counted.
I don't need to ask anyone anything to know that might does not make right.
If might made right, anything anyone could do would be right. There would be no right and wrong.
It simply isn't so. There is right and wrong.
Right and wrong are rational, abstract concepts. They are the product of reason. Reason makes right.
The Israelis had the power to take other people's land, just as the brown socialists now have the power to take other people's land in SA. However, neither the Israelis nor the socialists in SA have the right to take anyone's land.
 

the_shootist

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There would be no right and wrong.
You certainly have not been paying attention sir....there is indeed no right and wrong in America any more. This is the reason we got Trump!
 
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Son of Gloin

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You certainly have not been paying attention sir....there is indeed no right and wrong in America any more. This is how we got Trump!
Well, it's the reason we got Trump, anyway. Not necessarily how we got Trump, but I think that's what you meant.
 

Son of Gloin

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I don't need to ask anyone anything to know that might does not make right.
If might made right, anything anyone could do would be right. There would be no right and wrong.
It simply isn't so. There is right and wrong.
Right and wrong are rational, abstract concepts. They are the product of reason. Reason makes right.
The Israelis had the power to take other people's land, just as the brown socialists now have the power to take other people's land in SA. However, neither the Israelis nor the socialists in SA have the right to take anyone's land.
As with many of your posts, Libertaurum, I'm mostly in agreement with what you say. You always sneak in a sentence or two, though, that I just can't get behind. I gave you a "like" for the bulk of your statement.
 

Libertaurum

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You certainly have not been paying attention sir....there is indeed no right and wrong in America any more. This is how we got Trump!
You're right about the loss of principles leading to the current state of affairs, which is sad. However, there still is indeed right and wrong, regardless of what anyone in the US, America or the world might be led to believe.

As with many of your posts, Libertaurum, I'm mostly in agreement with what you say. You always sneak in a sentence or two, though, that I just can't get behind. I gave you a "like" for the bulk of your statement.
Thanks SOG. I wonder to which part of what I said you object.
 

Son of Gloin

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You're right about the loss of principles leading to the current state of affairs, which is sad. However, there still is indeed right and wrong, regardless of what anyone in the US, America or the world might be led to believe.


Thanks SOG. I wonder to which part of what I said you object.
Well, sometimes you come across as an idealist and sometimes you come across as a rationalist. In this most recent statement, you are coming through as a rationalist, since you claim that reason makes right, not might. I agree that reason is a better measuring rod for morality, or right, than force, however people can rationalize all kinds of stuff to suit their own desires and viewpoints. I believe there have to be immutable guiding moral principles that can only be supplied by God Himself, taking human reason and ideals out of the equation. That's where I disagree with you.
 

Libertaurum

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Well, sometimes you come across as an idealist and sometimes you come across as a rationalist. In this most recent statement, you are coming through as a rationalist, since you claim that reason makes right, not might. I agree that reason is a better measuring rod for morality, or right, than force, however people can rationalize all kinds of stuff to suit their own desires and viewpoints. I believe there have to be immutable guiding moral principles that can only be supplied by God Himself, taking human reason and ideals out of the equation. That's where I disagree with you.
Thanks for taking the time to explain that.

I don't try to come across a certain way and I don't know exactly what you consider the difference to be between a rationalist and an idealist. I'm not sure they are mutually exclusive, either. The term "idealist" also suggests unrealistic. Was Galileo an idealist or a rationalist? Or was he both?

As to your specific point of disagreement, if I understand you correctly, your objection is that reason is open to interpretation and can be used to justify anything, so we need God himself to supply guiding moral principles.

My objection to that is that, while our use of reason may at times be defective, reason is not subjective. And neither is right and wrong. Of course anything can be rationalized to suit certain agendas, but reason is much more accessible to most people than the mind of God. So long as God Himself doesn't directly supply those moral principles to each person on Earth, what God wants is much more open to being misrepresented to suit certain agendas than reason. History proves this. What God wants is much more open to debate than whether 2+2=4. Many more despots have had to recur to justifying the attrocities they commit as the will of God than those who have tried to use reason. Proponents of reason generally do not seek to rule others as despots. Proponents of the will of God often have.
 

Uncle

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Perhaps come and live here for a month. or two.

I'm just laughing my arse off at the African Expertise we have on this thread.

Africa is not for sissies.

Golden Regards
Uncle
 

DodgebyDave

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Perhaps come and live here for a month. or two.

I'm just laughing my arse off at the African Expertise we have on this thread.

Africa is not for sissies.

Golden Regards
Uncle
A friend of mine tried to talk me into joining the peace corp with him, lol, poor Joe!

The interview guy bounced me after 2 minutes into the first round, lol

Joe lasted about 2 weeks in Goatsmellawana. Little village just south of One Cow. 7 days drive from the closest airport that was 6 hours by Cessna caravan from the closest airport with indoor plumbing.

I was happy as hell I failed!
 

Uncle

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Golden Regards
Uncle
 

Uncle

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Pity DBD. The rest of Africa don't carry the vinegar chip on their shoulder.

If you can't 'work' here, where can you?

Golden Regards
Uncle
 

Uncle

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Another SA export.


Golden Regards
Uncle
 

Uncle

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Another African.


Golden Regards
Uncle
 

Son of Gloin

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My apologies for the thread drift. Very sorry.
 

Uncle

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Goatsmellawana

Now you're just talking shit.

Any case, up yours.

Golden Regards
Uncle
 

Uncle

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And you thought Trevor Raeburn was a local?

LMAO.

Regards
Uncle
 

DodgebyDave

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Pity DBD. The rest of Africa don't carry the vinegar chip on their shoulder.

If you can't 'work' here, where can you?

Golden Regards
Uncle
I'm too, "American". I left a cruise early because I couldn't get a double cheeseburger and fries.

Africa doesn't suck. What the globalists have done to Africa, that's what sucks.
 

Uncle

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DBD. I'll reply when I'm sober.

Golden Regards
Uncle

Check out

 
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searcher

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Well since we're doing tunes here's the official thread theme song...………….

Shakira - Waka Waka (This Time for Africa) (The Official 2010 FIFA World Cup™ Song)

 

Bottom Feeder

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Sorry to re-rail the thread, but...

Bank Tells South African Farmers They Will Have to Pay Debts for Property Seized by the State
Breitbart

South African farmers subjected to land expropriation without compensation will still have to pay off their debts for property which has been seized by the state, according to a major bank.
In an email from Nedbank widely circulated on social media, now confirmed as genuine by Head of Group Media Relations Kedibonea Molopyane, according to The South African, farmers are warned that their debts will have to be paid in full even after their property is confiscated by the government.

It reads as follows:
“It is important to note the Home Loan agreement is subject to a contractual agreement, and bond payments remain due and payable until such time that the bond is paid in full irrespective of any form of land expropriation – with or without compensation. We would encourage you to continue with the bond payments until such time a determination is made.”
Sort of like still having to pay off a car loan on a vehicle that has been totaled.
Only on a bit larger scale.
BF
 

searcher

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Let's see what's shakin in SA today...………….

South Africa Makes Rare Intervention to Contain Fuel Prices
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...tervenes-in-fuel-prices-as-consumers-strained

Boston Firm Admits ‘Massive Failure’ in Plan to Aid South Africa Tax Agency
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/09/02/world/africa/south-africa-tax-agency-bain.html

'Trump must really take his long hair and leave our people the hell alone' – SA farmers
https://www.news24.com/SouthAfrica/...-sa-farmers-reject-land-reform-tweet-20180826

Let South Africans 'resolve their own problems' - Magashule to Donald Trump
https://www.news24.com/SouthAfrica/...n-problems-magashule-to-donald-trump-20180903
 

searcher

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the_shootist

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Let's see what's shakin in SA today...………….

South Africa Makes Rare Intervention to Contain Fuel Prices
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...tervenes-in-fuel-prices-as-consumers-strained

Boston Firm Admits ‘Massive Failure’ in Plan to Aid South Africa Tax Agency
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/09/02/world/africa/south-africa-tax-agency-bain.html

'Trump must really take his long hair and leave our people the hell alone' – SA farmers
https://www.news24.com/SouthAfrica/...-sa-farmers-reject-land-reform-tweet-20180826

Let South Africans 'resolve their own problems' - Magashule to Donald Trump
https://www.news24.com/SouthAfrica/...n-problems-magashule-to-donald-trump-20180903
I agree that the white farmers in SA are not our problem. We need to stop sticking our noses in other people's business. That being said, no aid...zero, zilch, Nada, to SA
 

the_shootist

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the_shootist

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As Land Confiscations Loom, South Africa Rules 300,000 Gun-Owners Turn Over Their Weapons
If they do they deserve to be wiped out, as they surely will be, and not a drop of American blood had better be shed to defend them!
 
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GOLDZILLA

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I have dusted off my old crystal ball and have a prediction for the future. Maybe whoever is here 20 years from now will remember this prognostication of mine and either laugh at me or start a cult of people whose sole purpose in life will be to find out if I made any other predictions that they can benefit from in their future...



Here is my prediction:



They will take all of the land but in the end it will be not in the hands of the local black population. It will be, in the end ... in the hands of the Chinese.
 

searcher

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Theft & Murder in South Africa | Lauren Southern Interview 2018
Roaming Millennial


Published on Sep 3, 2018
Learn To Profit Everyday In The Markets! Click Here -
http://www.tradegeniusacademy.com

Lauren Southern joins to discuss her documentary Farmlands, the ongoing seizures of white farmers land in South Africa, and the murders that have lead up to this humanitarian crisis.

FAIR USE NOTICE
This video may contain copyrighted material; the use of which has not been specifically authorized by the copyright owner. We are making such material available for the purposes of criticism, comment, review and news reporting which constitute the fair use of any such copyrighted material as provided for in section 107 of the US Copyright Law. Not withstanding the provisions of sections 106 and 106A, the fair use of a copyrighted work for purposes such as criticism, comment, review and news reporting is not an infringement of copyright.
 

andial

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These white south africans need a “Q”
Thread so they think they are winning maybe have some stupid shit leaders dressed up as comic book heros and a comic book plan also. Someone get Lionel on it.
 

Joseph

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Might makes right, if you can steal it, you should, just ask the Israelis...we can't lead by example here guys, we were silent when it counted.
When has it ever been different ? "just ask < insert your favorite country here >"

The world is one big mafia. Always has been ... always will be ...

we can be lucky enough to live under the tyranny of a big dog, or unfortunate enough to have to live under tyranny of a little dog - either way, we live in a tyranny

quote-we-have-to-call-it-freedom-who-d-want-to-die-for-a-lesser-tyranny-mignon-mclaughlin-66-4...jpg
 

searcher

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White South African workers protest against Sasol's black share scheme

Reuters

September 3, 2018


JOHANNESBURG (Reuters) - Workers from South Africa's mainly-white Solidarity union staged a go-slow protest at the petrochemicals firm Sasol on Monday over a share scheme offered exclusively to black staff, and said they would begin a full strike on Thursday.

South African companies are required to meet quotas on black ownership, employment and procurement as part of a drive to reverse decades of exclusion under apartheid. Meeting the rules makes a company more likely to qualify for government tenders.

Solidarity has been waging a challenge against racial quotas in the workplace, and lodged a complaint against the policy in 2016 with the U.N. Human Rights Commission.

Sasol, the world leader in technology that converts coal and gas to fuel, has sold 25 percent of its local operations to qualifying black employees, a foundation and the black public in a 21 billion rand ($1.5 billion) deal financed by the company.

It has said the scheme is not a benefit but a mechanism designed to meet the rules on black economic empowerment, and was backed by shareholders.

But Solidarity said the scheme was discriminatory and that it would file a complaint to U.S. regulators. Sasol also operates in the United States.
The union said 6,300 of its members would hold a go-slow at Sasol's facilities in South Africa, and then strike on Thursday.

"We are not against the scheme, we just want it to be inclusive of all workers. If the company makes it inclusive, the majority will still be black, so we see no need to exclude white workers as this is discrimination," said Dirk Hermann, Solidarity's chief executive.

Sasol, which employs around 26,000 people in South Africa, said it was aware of Solidarity's intent to strike, and that it had made contingency plans.

SHARES SLIP

Sasol's shares were 1.4 percent lower at 568.14 rand, with the market expecting the dispute to be resolved without affecting earnings.

A Sasol spokesman said parts of the flagship Secunda and Sasolberg plants, which produce fuel and chemicals respectively, were anyway undergoing scheduled maintenance shutdowns, but that both plants otherwise continued to operate.

The ruling African National Congress said in a statement that it was concerned by the "obsession with perpetuating racial polarization" triggered by Solidarity's protest.

Solidarity's Hermann said the union was not promoting racism and had backed schemes at AngloGold Ashanti and iron ore mining firm Kumba that treated white and black workers equally.

But it was in court challenging an empowerment scheme at the cement firm PPC that grants each black worker twice as many shares as a white worker.

Herman said Solidarity had also challenged a similar scheme at South Africa's biggest mobile operator, Vodacom, but had been hampered by its low members' roll at the firm.

The Commission for Conciliation, Mediation and Arbitration, which mediates in labor disputes, ruled that Solidarity did not have a legal right to challenge Sasol's scheme in court, but could push its cause through industrial action.

"We expect Sasol to come to the negotiating table," Hermann said. ($1 = 14.7478 rand)

(Reporting by James Macharia; Editing by Kevin Liffey)

https://ca.news.yahoo.com/white-sasol-workers-stage-protest-over-black-share-093109552--finance.html
 

Uncle

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Well Searcher while you want to post your garbage in this thread. Just continue as you know best. A loota continua.

Thanks Shooter, up yours too.

Golden Regards
Uncle
 

the_shootist

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Well Searcher while you want to post your garbage in this thread. Just continue as you know best. A loota continua.

Thanks Shooter, up yours too.

Golden Regards
Uncle
The way I see it you have two choices, either turn over your guns and surely die or use them and probably still die but die fighting. There's no 3rd choice that I can see other than get the hell outta there while you still can. When are you going to say enough is enough down there?

You have a nigger problem in SA and we have a Bolshevik Communist Jew problem in the US. We'll need to make the same choices you're faced with now here soon enough. 300 millions guns will NOT be turned over in the US, that I can tell you!
 
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