• Same story, different day...........year ie more of the same fiat floods the world
  • There are no markets
  • "Spreading the ideas of freedom loving people on matters regarding high finance, politics, constructionist Constitution, and mental masturbation of all types"

Standing Liberty 2016 Centennial Gold Coin

MrLucky

Silver Member
Silver Miner
Site Supporter
Joined
Apr 27, 2011
Messages
1,002
Likes
490
Location
On the Fortuna II
#81
I cant imagine if spot stays the same you wouldn't be able to sell them for slightly more than what you paid in 5 years.
Point well taken. If I'm still around in 5 years, I'll see if I made a mistake or not. It wouldn't be the first one I made. I had the opportunity to buy the 2009 UHR from the mint and didn't. Now I wish I had.

If I remember correctly, they had a purchase limit on those too. But had to remove it to move the rest. Maybe the same will happen to the quarter.

Where's that time machine parked?
 

CrimsonGuardJay

Silver Member
Silver Miner
Joined
May 16, 2014
Messages
1,757
Likes
1,207
#82
Point well taken. If I'm still around in 5 years, I'll see if I made a mistake or not. It wouldn't be the first one I made. I had the opportunity to buy the 2009 UHR from the mint and didn't. Now I wish I had.

If I remember correctly, they had a purchase limit on those too. But had to remove it to move the rest. Maybe the same will happen to the quarter.

Where's that time machine parked?
The UHR is hands down the best modern gold commemorative released by the mint. Nothing else really comes close, not the reverse proof buffalo, not the first spouses, not these 1916 releases... Nothing.

If you haven't found a details-damaged example to de-slab and hold, it truly is amazing, like nothing else out there. If I could buy these for spot +100, I'd gladly get those over gold eagles and maples any day.
 

Starter

Silver Member
Silver Miner
Joined
Jan 31, 2013
Messages
770
Likes
126
#83
Be careful with ultra high graded coins. Standards change and companies change. Always buy the coin, not the holder. 2c

I was trying to highlight the comparison between the precious metal value of the gold coins and the rarity of the silver coins.

Even if you just stay with MS 60 grade for the 1916 silver coins, the original 1916 silver standing liberty quarter has sold for around $10,000 in auctions.
 

CrimsonGuardJay

Silver Member
Silver Miner
Joined
May 16, 2014
Messages
1,757
Likes
1,207
#84
I was trying to highlight the comparison between the precious metal value of the gold coins and the rarity of the silver coins.

Even if you just stay with MS 60 grade for the 1916 silver coins, the original 1916 silver standing liberty quarter has sold for around $10,000 in auctions.
I just took a look myself, how the hell is this possible? Did they make like 12 that year or something?
 

Starter

Silver Member
Silver Miner
Joined
Jan 31, 2013
Messages
770
Likes
126
#85
I just took a look myself, how the hell is this possible? Did they make like 12 that year or something?
The original mintage for the 1916 standing liberty quarter was 52,000, but only about 430 graded by NGC as MS 60 or higher.

The mercury dime is the most affordable in mint state of the 1916 coins, with prices under $50.
 

CrimsonGuardJay

Silver Member
Silver Miner
Joined
May 16, 2014
Messages
1,757
Likes
1,207
#86
The original mintage for the 1916 standing liberty quarter was 52,000, but only about 430 graded by NGC as MS 60 or higher.

The mercury dime is the most affordable in mint state of the 1916 coins, with prices under $50.
Thats pretty insane right there.

I wanted a standing liberty quarter once, it was shown in an episode of mad men in a flashback sequence, that showed Don Draper in the early 1930s, a homeless man passed through and offered to do chores and farmwork in exchange for a bed and a hot meal. His stepmother stated that she understands the difficulties of being homeless and retrieved a single standing liberty quarter for him.


But then I woke up and saw the prices on those things were so far beyond anything that could be considered reasonable unless they were worn down to a guitar-pick.
 
Last edited:

Starter

Silver Member
Silver Miner
Joined
Jan 31, 2013
Messages
770
Likes
126
#87
Thats pretty insane right there.

I wanted a standing liberty quarter once, it was shown in an episode of mad men in a flashback sequence, that showed Don Draper in the early 1930s, a homeless man passed through and offered to do chores and farmwork in exchange for a bed and a hot meal. His stepmother stated that she understands the difficulties of being homeless and retrieved a single standing liberty quarter for him.


But then I woke up and saw the prices on those things were so far beyond anything that could be considered reasonable unless they were worn down to a guitar-pick.

It is definitely a scarce coin, but I think most of the price is inflated.

My very own 1906-s gold 5-dollar coin graded MS 62 by NGC has less than 300 NGC coins graded equal or higher, but its current selling price is only in the 400s, even with its higher precious metal content.

The reality is that the standing liberty quarter is a very strong brand in coin collecting, but the liberty 5-dollar coin is just starting to get noticed.
 
Last edited:

Starter

Silver Member
Silver Miner
Joined
Jan 31, 2013
Messages
770
Likes
126
#88
I called the coin shop today to tell them that the Standing Liberty Gold Quarter just arrived.

The shop owner's son answered the phone, and he was the same person who gave the price quote last Wednesday. He was happy to hear that the coin arrived, and he was happy to confirm that the same price he quoted last week ($50 + the issue price) still holds.

I will be going there Thursday during lunchtime to deliver the coin.

Finally delivered the coin to the dealer today and received cash in the amount agreed upon earlier (535, or 45.05 over the cost of the coin + shipping).

I am glad that the owner kept his word regarding the price, even when knowing the coin did poorly in its 1st week and will almost certainly decrease in value during the coming weeks. Originally, he wanted an unopened package, but he said this time he would be opening it for a customer who wants the coin. When the owner went to get the cash, I asked whether I could take a picture of it, and he said sure...


std_lib_gld_qtr_small.jpg




It is truly an impressive coin, but I am now happy that the coin is out of my hands, with the cash reward now safely deposited in the bank...
 

CrimsonGuardJay

Silver Member
Silver Miner
Joined
May 16, 2014
Messages
1,757
Likes
1,207
#89
Finally delivered the coin to the dealer today and received cash in the amount agreed upon earlier (535, or 45.05 over the cost of the coin + shipping).

I am glad that the owner kept his word regarding the price, even when knowing the coin did poorly in its 1st week and will almost certainly decrease in value during the coming weeks. Originally, he wanted an unopened package, but he said this time he would be opening it for a customer who wants the coin. When the owner went to get the cash, I asked whether I could take a picture of it, and he said sure...


View attachment 84854



It is truly an impressive coin, but I am now happy that the coin is out of my hands, with the cash reward now safely deposited in the bank...
I got mine yesterday as well, but I'll be keeping it.

The way i see it, a local coin dealer might give you or I +50 for it, and maybe if I threw it on ebay right now someone would give me +100 (doubtful)...

The reality of it is, as an insurance professional, I worked for a few hours on the phone and doing data entry and I probably made close to $1,000 or more... I gotta face it, the only way I'll "make money" with buying and selling is just hoping some good run-up to $2,000 an ounce happens in the coming years. No idea.
 

Starter

Silver Member
Silver Miner
Joined
Jan 31, 2013
Messages
770
Likes
126
#90
I got mine yesterday as well, but I'll be keeping it.

The way i see it, a local coin dealer might give you or I +50 for it, and maybe if I threw it on ebay right now someone would give me +100 (doubtful)...

The reality of it is, as an insurance professional, I worked for a few hours on the phone and doing data entry and I probably made close to $1,000 or more... I gotta face it, the only way I'll "make money" with buying and selling is just hoping some good run-up to $2,000 an ounce happens in the coming years. No idea.

I understand your point of view, especially after looking at the coin and taking a close-up picture of it...

Most of us on this forum have a background in stacking and numismatics. From a numismatics point of view, this is a great coin because it symbolizes one of the greatest icons in coin collecting by replicating the coin in gold, on the 100th anniversary of the initial coin minting. From a stacking point of view, this coin has an excessive premium of 47% over its melt value, with today's spot price. Even gold commemorative coins sold at the Mint (which I plan to buy this year) have a lower premium, at 33%.

Putting numismatics and stacking together, one also may realize that the mintage is unusually high for its premium, with the only remaining strengths being the excellent quality of the coin and the great name of the standing liberty quarter brand. If you believe in these strengths, then you are one more person to justify any upward price movement for this coin. But there are probably equally many people in the market who will provide a justification for the price to move downward.
 

MrLucky

Silver Member
Silver Miner
Site Supporter
Joined
Apr 27, 2011
Messages
1,002
Likes
490
Location
On the Fortuna II
#93
Just remember if metals run to the moon, numismatics wont mean much.
I'd have to disagree... Numismatics often continue to maintain the price above spot...
I'm paraphrasing a bit as I can't remember the exact statement, but in Jordan's book, he addresses this. I believe the $ value he was talking about was in the neighborhood of $5000.

"As the price of gold increases, the premium above spot (for numi's) decreases to the point where there is no premium."
 

southfork

Site Supporter
Site Supporter
Mother Lode
Joined
Mar 31, 2010
Messages
14,794
Likes
13,209
#94
I'd have to disagree... Numismatics often continue to maintain the price above spot... The UHR is a good example of that.
Don't doubt there will be some exceptions to that. You are right. Im talking about the lower end of the spectrum
 

CrimsonGuardJay

Silver Member
Silver Miner
Joined
May 16, 2014
Messages
1,757
Likes
1,207
#95
I'm paraphrasing a bit as I can't remember the exact statement, but in Jordan's book, he addresses this. I believe the $ value he was talking about was in the neighborhood of $5000.

"As the price of gold increases, the premium above spot (for numi's) decreases to the point where there is no premium."
If the price of spot explodes by $500, then I can live with that, in general.
 

Starter

Silver Member
Silver Miner
Joined
Jan 31, 2013
Messages
770
Likes
126
#96
If the price of spot explodes by $500, then I can live with that, in general.
If you plan to keep the coin, then I think that hoping for gold to reach 5000 dollars is your best bet for the coin's future. A spot gold price of 5000 would encourage more melting of the coin, with the possibility of turning the coin from an over-minted coin to a scarce one.

After gold crashes down from 5000, you would emerge with a better coin than you had before (that is, assuming that you had other gold coins to cash in on the spot price of 5000 instead of the gold quarter).
 

CrimsonGuardJay

Silver Member
Silver Miner
Joined
May 16, 2014
Messages
1,757
Likes
1,207
#97
If you plan to keep the coin, then I think that hoping for gold to reach 5000 dollars is your best bet for the coin's future. A spot gold price of 5000 would encourage more melting of the coin, with the possibility of turning the coin from an over-minted coin to a scarce one.

After gold crashes down from 5000, you would emerge with a better coin than you had before (that is, assuming that you had other gold coins to cash in on the spot price of 5000 instead of the gold quarter).

Thats a good point. Personally, when it comes to actually selling, I think greshams law would apply and people would sell bars and rounds before they would sell That ultra high relief or standing liberty, mercury dime, etc.
 

Starter

Silver Member
Silver Miner
Joined
Jan 31, 2013
Messages
770
Likes
126
Advantage dealers.

The household limit was the only reason they needed help from individuals like us. With their ability to sell coins at a profit without paying selling fees, regular guys like us are left in the dust because we still need to overcome the steep fees in order to make a profit.

Good thing I sold my one coin already to the dealer...
 

CrimsonGuardJay

Silver Member
Silver Miner
Joined
May 16, 2014
Messages
1,757
Likes
1,207
Advantage dealers.

The household limit was the only reason they needed help from individuals like us. With their ability to sell coins at a profit without paying selling fees, regular guys like us are left in the dust because we still need to overcome the steep fees in order to make a profit.

Good thing I sold my one coin already to the dealer...
There are ways to sell without fees, but yes, it is a challenge. eBay, PayPal, etc.. Those are obviously an issue.

Truthfully, bullion coins are actually a good investment for avoiding fees: there's a company in my Oklahoma City that will wire money to you when you send them a tracked package with said inside.
 

Dude

Midas Member
Midas Member
Joined
Mar 31, 2010
Messages
4,608
Likes
1,517
Ya, took the $50 bounty, fortunately. I did pick up an SP70 PCGS dime for $245 before the 8% ebay bucks expired. Hoping for a near issue price pickup for the quarter as well.
 

Starter

Silver Member
Silver Miner
Joined
Jan 31, 2013
Messages
770
Likes
126
I can't say much about how these coins will do next year, but one thing I know is that with the household limit removed now, this coin will take sales away from other Mint products, especially gold coins.

This is good news for collectors interested in other gold coins sold by the Mint, who may want those coins to be as low in mintage as possible.
 

Starter

Silver Member
Silver Miner
Joined
Jan 31, 2013
Messages
770
Likes
126
Latest mintage report of the Standing Liberty gold quarter...

Precious Metal Products 16XC 2016 STANDING LIBERTY 24K GOLD .25OZ 85325 12/18/2016


Still not sold out, after a few months!
 

Silver Art

Silver Art Bar collector
Site Supporter
Platinum Bling
Joined
Sep 4, 2011
Messages
4,441
Likes
2,541
Location
Tennessee
As of now (12:50 AM, June 24, 2017), the 1/4-oz Standing Liberty gold coin is still available for sale at USMint.gov web site. The June 18, 2017 USMint report shows the mintage at 89,463 (out of maximum mintage of 100,000).
 

Silver Art

Silver Art Bar collector
Site Supporter
Platinum Bling
Joined
Sep 4, 2011
Messages
4,441
Likes
2,541
Location
Tennessee
Exactly a year later................................


The 1/4-oz Standing Liberty Centennial gold coin is still available for sale. Currently priced at $485. Current mintage as of Sept. 3 USMint report is 90,024 (out of max. mintage of 100,000).
 

CrimsonGuardJay

Silver Member
Silver Miner
Joined
May 16, 2014
Messages
1,757
Likes
1,207
Exactly a year later................................


The 1/4-oz Standing Liberty Centennial gold coin is still available for sale. Currently priced at $485. Current mintage as of Sept. 3 USMint report is 90,024 (out of max. mintage of 100,000).
It ain't gonna sell out. That coin ended up being a dud. They should have minted 40,000
 

savvydon

Gold Member
Gold Chaser
Joined
Dec 14, 2010
Messages
2,283
Likes
1,733
It ain't gonna sell out. That coin ended up being a dud. They should have minted 40,000
I don't see the need to have the Mint create instant rarities with low mintages that sell out instantly. This is a nice collector coin to buy IF YOU WANT TO COLLECT IT. If you are looking to flip it for a profit then, yes, it was a dud. Still, I don't think it is the Mints responsibility to create a secondary market where adroit flippers can thrive. They are there to create coins that collectors may want to collect. 2c
 

CrimsonGuardJay

Silver Member
Silver Miner
Joined
May 16, 2014
Messages
1,757
Likes
1,207
I don't see the need to have the Mint create instant rarities with low mintages that sell out instantly. This is a nice collector coin to buy IF YOU WANT TO COLLECT IT. If you are looking to flip it for a profit then, yes, it was a dud. Still, I don't think it is the Mints responsibility to create a secondary market where adroit flippers can thrive. They are there to create coins that collectors may want to collect. 2c
Yeah, but 40,000 still isn't rare, at all.
 

savvydon

Gold Member
Gold Chaser
Joined
Dec 14, 2010
Messages
2,283
Likes
1,733
It's all relative, and by some standards a 40,000 mintage could be considered scarce, if not actually rare.

The thing is, a 40,000 max mintage might have been a small enough number to create a quick sell out for this coin, which would have led to aftermarket price gouging. Don't get me wrong, I have done a flip or two in my day, and enjoyed doing so. Still, I don't think creating demand and rarity is necessarily the Mint's responsibility. Not doing so in and of itself does not, in my opinion, make a coin a dud.
 

CrimsonGuardJay

Silver Member
Silver Miner
Joined
May 16, 2014
Messages
1,757
Likes
1,207
It's all relative, and by some standards a 40,000 mintage could be considered scarce, if not actually rare.

The thing is, a 40,000 max mintage might have been a small enough number to create a quick sell out for this coin, which would have led to aftermarket price gouging. Don't get me wrong, I have done a flip or two in my day, and enjoyed doing so. Still, I don't think creating demand and rarity is necessarily the Mint's responsibility. Not doing so in and of itself does not, in my opinion, make a coin a dud.
Then they shouldn't be selling them for that silly price. It's not scarce, it's not appropriately priced, and it's barely even good looking.
 

savvydon

Gold Member
Gold Chaser
Joined
Dec 14, 2010
Messages
2,283
Likes
1,733
Then they shouldn't be selling them for that silly price. It's not scarce, it's not appropriately priced, and it's barely even good looking.
We all have opinions... buying these from the Mint IS optional after all.

By way of historical perspective, the gold Indian Quarter Eagle series has as its key the 1911-D, which sells for many multiples of the rest of the series, thanks to a low mintage of 55,680.

As to price, there certainly is a premium over spot, somewhere in the 30% range, which is not inconsequential. What the collector gets for this premium is handsome packaging and a well executed US gold coin which commemorates classic US silver coin. Apparently many felt that the premium paid was worth what they got - myself included.

As to not being good looking, the coin is a faithful reproduction of the famed standing liberty quarter, struck on the 100th anniversary of that coins introduction. You can argue the merits of the design if you like, but you can't argue the plain fact that the coin/design is a classic part of US History, struck during the golden age when the US was emerging as a leading world power.
 

Silver Art

Silver Art Bar collector
Site Supporter
Platinum Bling
Joined
Sep 4, 2011
Messages
4,441
Likes
2,541
Location
Tennessee
40,000 mintage is subjective. 40,000 mintage could be high for some coins and it could be low for other coins. It depends on several other variables. As for the Centennial Standing Liberty gold coin, from a flipper's perspective, it was a dud. From a collector's point of view, they bought what they liked and probably did not care about the premium they paid nor did they probably not care about how high or low the current mintage is.

Whether the Centennial gold coin is good looking or not is a matter of opinion and people can vote with their pocket books on this coin.

BTW, as a side note..................Most (if not all) gold and silver coins minted from the US Mint are high premium coins. Do not expect to pay, for example, only $0.50 over spot silver for a newly released 1-oz .999 silver collector coin when you order directly from the US Mint. There is no such thing as a newly released low premium gold or silver coin from the US Mint.