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Tulving, the aftermath from 3.4.14

Tinbox

YOU GET NOTHING! YOU LOSE, GOOD DAY SIR!
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#2
Re: Tulving out of Business

Hopefully everyone is made whole or close to it at least. Unfortunately that's probably not the case if he is closing the doors.
 

Cornelius

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#3
Re: Tulving out of Business

Wow. At one time, they were a very reliable outfit.

It sure would have hurt bad to have gotten burned on a deal. :thumpdown:
 

azxcvbnm321

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#4
Re: Tulving out of Business

It's sad to see greed get the better of a man and an once successful operation. He gambled on gold futures/options and lost, but he didn't have the money to make that kind of gamble in the first place. Greed and poor risk management did the company in.
 

~BS

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#5
Re: Tulving out of Business

Hopefully everyone is made whole or close to it at least. Unfortunately that's probably not the case if he is closing the doors.
I doubt it. That website he's referencing is estimating customers are out 47.5 million.

------
The goal of this page is to help people from law enforcement, consumer protection, and other related agencies easily understand that we are dealing with a nearly $50M fraud.

The Tulving Company is operating illegally, and I believe that The Tulving Company has an estimated $47.5M of outstanding bullion orders, without essentially no money to pay for the metal. In other words, they have stolen $47.5M from their customers.
 

TomD

It blowed up, y'all
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#6
Re: Tulving out of Business

This is a testament to the effectiveness of the GIM dealer feedback area. The Tulving problem was picked up there, don't remember exactly when but more than a year ago when some guy posted that he had waited months for a monster chest or two. Most everyone, including me, assured him that it had to be a glitch because Tulving had been such a good reputable dealer. I guess that all systems work, until they don't.

Before executing a large PM buy with even a trusted dealer, it couldn't hurt to go to dealer feedback to make sure that there have been no changes in the dealers performance.

Late deliveries seem usually to be the mark of coming failure but not always. Northwest Territorial Mint has been using a business model of taking many months to send metal for 9 years that I'm aware of. They seem to be still alive and pissing off customers, as indicated on this review site: http://golddealerreviews.com/reviews/gold-dealers/8-northwest-territorial-mint
 

Scorpio

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#7
Guys,

This will be a place to keep up with the developing story and aftermath,

Please keep it to facts and not speculations as best as possible,

Walk a mile in anothers shoes comes to mind,

Scorp
 

Cornelius

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#9
Hey Scorp,

Good idea.

There is bound to be several events to unfold. Perhaps a sticky is in order, because it is bound to lag over time.
 

2014

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#10
Tulving is closed today.. No employees or cars.. Only a company van.. Not sure if this is news or speculation.
 

Scorpio

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#11
2014 sent packing for 7 days,

doesn't seem to get it,

now I have to go back and clean up his rants,

and to answer a question on it, there is no need for a 'polling' thread on the T,

the thread is done because the company no longer exists,
 

luckabuck

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#12
OMG! But for the existence of the past few months, I could have been in deep doo-doo. He had a huge pot of my money, and with the threat of law enforcement involvement, I finally got my bullion. I feel so very, very sorry for the people who got shafted by his closure, and legal/law enforcement should have done something earlier in my opinion ..... just so thankful that I was made whole before this happened. Hope this works out for the people still owed their money investment, and someone pays for this terrible situation.
 
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#14
Re: Tulving out of Business

First MtGox, now Tulving. At this rate, soon there won't be a single reputable, trustworthy dealer left for your bitcoin and gold needs.
 

CopperSilverGold

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#19
Re: Tulving out of Business

No ,maintain your relationship with your local coin shop. When that fails .........zombies
Couldn't agree more. Cash and carry on the spot, you see what you're buying and no anxiety waiting weeks or months for the items to show up. It's worth the extra premium you may pay IMHO.
 

Rollie Free

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#21
Re: Tulving out of Business

No ,maintain your relationship with your local coin shop. When that fails .........zombies
Don't you think that would be preferable to most everyone on here if that were an option?

I have three locals. One is more interested in stamps, his inventory has layers of dust because he's trying to hit a home run with every sale. Another is simply a waste of time, quit going in there several years ago (really believes in buy low, sell high). The only decent place around is the guy who suggested I buy online. He makes his fortune buying old jewelry. We have the burden of 7.5% sales tax. That makes it near impossible for a dealer to turn around a profit buying and selling bullion with locals.
 

gringott

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#22
Re: Tulving out of Business

Don't you think that would be preferable to most everyone on here if that were an option?

I have three locals. One is more interested in stamps, his inventory has layers of dust because he's trying to hit a home run with every sale. Another is simply a waste of time, quit going in there several years ago (really believes in buy low, sell high). The only decent place around is the guy who suggested I buy online. He makes his fortune buying old jewelry. We have the burden of 7.5% sales tax. That makes it near impossible for a dealer to turn around a profit buying and selling bullion with locals.
It's worse around me if you can believe it.
 

Rusty Shackelford

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#24
OMG! But for the existence of the past few months, I could have been in deep doo-doo. He had a huge pot of my money, and with the threat of law enforcement involvement, I finally got my bullion. I feel so very, very sorry for the people who got shafted by his closure, and legal/law enforcement should have done something earlier in my opinion ..... just so thankful that I was made whole before this happened. Hope this works out for the people still owed their money investment, and someone pays for this terrible situation.
Check out rules on preferential payments in bankruptcy. I would not sleep tight quite yet.:(
 

luckabuck

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#27
Take my word for it. NO ONE WANTS TO BE A CANARY AND ELIGIBLE FOR OPEN SEASON ON BIRDS FROM OTHER POSTERS.
 

Montecristo

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#28
Re: Tulving out of Business

Again, I just want to say thank you to the posters on here who sounded the early warning, placing a seed of suspicion in my mind. That, coupled with Hannes acting rudely toward me, caused me to cease doing business with him. Otherwise I surely would have been involved in this mess.

I'm truly sorry for anyone who is out their money or their metal.

Also, another thank you to about.ag. If I ever meet you, your drinks are on me!
 

Montecristo

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#29
Re: Tulving out of Business

Also, Something for you guys having problems buying from your local coin shop to consider. The LCS takes quite a chance buying an item and waiting for someone to walk in the door looking for that particular item so he can sell it.

If you tell him what you are looking for, and promise him that you will come and buy it immediately WHENEVER he gets it, he may be more willing to work on a lower margin with you or at the very least he will be more confident in his buying if he knows he can sell it the same day or the next day. To get him to believe you this will require several visits and several requests.

But the responsibility of this falls on you. If he does buy something with you in mind and calls you, you better get your ass over there right away. Otherwise you can forget about any special treatment.

If your willing to put your money where your mouth is despite the spot price at the time, you will be surprised at how willing he will be to work with you.
 

GOLD DUCK

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#30
Re: Tulving out of Business

QWAK,Back in the day when the old man was runing the Tulving business I would call and talk to him :chat: some times for 20 min or more -- he took time and I apreciated it.:thumbs_up::cheerful:

When the old man got sick and his son took over things changed :thumbs_down: no time to talk and much higher minimal orders --- he did not want small PM buyers.:realmad::thumbs_down:

The kid ran his fathers lifetime honorable business in to the ground:thumbs_down::cry_smile: -- then dough a hole to HELL!:devil1:

It is happening faster and faster :burnout: all the lies and deceptions hoaxes and scams are being exposed!:congrats:

When the last DODO died no one noticed or cared :36_1_30: back then "DODOS" were fast food litterly :eating: --- next stop some NEW WORLD they had heard about.:yes::s13: and a DODO = a HAPPY MEAL!:yes::4_1_72:

Personaly I got to ask ---- "ARE we there YET?" :questionmark::dontknow:

the DUCK :15_1_70v:
 

caselurker

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#31
I started a thread on Dec. 3, 2012 ("Bullion coin supply") about the unusually low inventory/limited selection at Tulving at the moment. At the time, one theory another member posted was there was a run on things due to purported mint errors. Now I'm wondering if there was more to it and that this was an early indication of some serious issues. Very sad situation.
 

CopperSilverGold

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#32
Re: Tulving out of Business

Don't you think that would be preferable to most everyone on here if that were an option?

I have three locals. One is more interested in stamps, his inventory has layers of dust because he's trying to hit a home run with every sale. Another is simply a waste of time, quit going in there several years ago (really believes in buy low, sell high). The only decent place around is the guy who suggested I buy online. He makes his fortune buying old jewelry. We have the burden of 7.5% sales tax. That makes it near impossible for a dealer to turn around a profit buying and selling bullion with locals.
The tax on bullion applies here too, but our state also taxes purchases made out of state that you have shipped in (on an honor system, paid on annual tax return). In theory, you can probably get around it by buying online from an out of state dealer but if you are buying with in big volume, that may raise red flags. I don't think they will bother if you spend $100 and don't pay the sales tax on it with the tax return. With a local dealer and doing enough volume, they may in turn eventually give you a bit of a pricebreak. Relationship building is the key. I buy/sell from a local dealer and have such a good relationship that they pay me about 10% more than regular customers when I need fiat, and give me a better rate than the general public on purchases. :thumbs_up:
 

Rcpb2000

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#33
Re: Tulving out of Business

No ,maintain your relationship with your local coin shop. When that fails .........zombies
The lcs by me had very high premiums. If you tried to sell them something, they would offer less than a pawn shop would. The pawn shops by me sell for less when it is available and pay more than the lcs. I wasn't surprised when the lcs closed down two of its shops and only kept its main one.

I still remember walking in one of their shops trying to sell $80 worth of silver coins. They were so gracious and offered to buy the coins for $40 assuming I didn't know the true value. Sold it for spot a few days later. Never went back there.
 

About.Ag

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#34
I started a thread on Dec. 3, 2012 ("Bullion coin supply") about the unusually low inventory/limited selection at Tulving at the moment. At the time, one theory another member posted was there was a run on things due to purported mint errors. Now I'm wondering if there was more to it and that this was an early indication of some serious issues. Very sad situation.
Tulving was having issues back then, although less severe. I'm working on a "post mortem" of Tulving, trying to track down exactly when it started and so forth.

I believe that Tulving switched from selling his own inventory to mostly drop-shipping around 2011-2012. I believe his problems started in the middle of 2012. In December, 2012 one person reported getting an item that Tulving had in-stock within a couple days, while another reported getting an item Tulving drop-shipped that took several weeks. So Tulving may have lost money in mid-2012, and selling off their inventory (not replenishing it) to make up for the loss. I believe they sold almost all their inventory, and then switched to almost exclusively drop-shipping. So he was likely carrying fractionals in stock, but did not have a reseller who sold them.
 

Usc96

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#35
Tulving was having issues back then, although less severe. I'm working on a "post mortem" of Tulving, trying to track down exactly when it started and so forth.

I believe that Tulving switched from selling his own inventory to mostly drop-shipping around 2011-2012. I believe his problems started in the middle of 2012. In December, 2012 one person reported getting an item that Tulving had in-stock within a couple days, while another reported getting an item Tulving drop-shipped that took several weeks. So Tulving may have lost money in mid-2012, and selling off their inventory (not replenishing it) to make up for the loss. I believe they sold almost all their inventory, and then switched to almost exclusively drop-shipping. So he was likely carrying fractionals in stock, but did not have a reseller who sold them.
Excuse the ignorance, but what is drop shipping?
 

Ragnarok

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#37
Drop shipping is a common practice, especially when ordering from big online retailers (Amazon, etc). They don't have to keep items in stock, drawing/shipping directly from a larger pool of distributors/manufacturers. It's like having multiple warehouses on tap for your item listings.

For precious metals it can mean having items shipped from depositories/places that are larger and more secure than yours.

R.
 

azxcvbnm321

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#38
Re: Tulving out of Business

When you go into a coin shop, I think it's expected that you negotiate the price. Unfortunately, the coin shops have to pay rent and have to take the risk of holding on to bullion when it could move down a lot in price. Think about the shop that bought gold at $1600, there is no possible way to make a profit from that transaction. Too many of those and they go out of business. So when they offer below spot, I don't necessarily think they're ripping you off. Just tell them that you want spot and if they refuse, you can leave or haggle some more. By all means take the best offer available to you, but as a business owner who has had to haggle before, it's not personal, and it really depends on the situation or day. Always mention that you'll be back to buy or sell more if he accepts, business owners want your repeat business and are willing to make less if that means you'll do more business with them. Again, don't be offended, I've made low/high offers before because I thought the person wasn't really interested in buying or selling but was there to scope out prices, maybe for the competition. I've been wrong before, the point is that an initial offer is made for many reasons other than to rip you off. It's easy to rip off someone once, but doing it again is rare and business owners know that most of their business comes from repeat customers so trying to rip off customers is a sure way to fail.
 

MrLucky

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#39
I had hoped that one day I could scrape together enough funds to buy from Tulving. Now I see I don't have that problem anymore. Best of luck to those who did. I hope you are made whole again.
 

Ahillock

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#40
Re: Tulving out of Business

This guy can be a little obnoxious and annoying. Skip first 45 seconds. Was posted ~ 2 weeks ago.


[video=youtube_share;qDutEjAwV-E]http://youtu.be/qDutEjAwV-E[/video]